Is It Okay To Allow A Third Team Member?

Dyv · Post by **Dyv** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 5:20 am

Originally posted by Maroon and White:

Greg - As someone who may have two other partners participate in Ultimate, I'd prefer to NOT allow all 3 at the draft table. A third owner sitting behind the table could see other owners' laptop screens, create "crowding" issues as all three huddle to converse, etc. I don't see anything gained by the third owner at the table, and it could very easily create tension with other teams given the stakes involved. Maroon, just so I hear what you're saying... if the tables for Ultimate were pushed back and each owner had MORE physical space than we had last year in the main event then you'd be okay with it.. right?

How about something crazy like every other owner sits on the inside of the U or the outside of the U so that nobody facing your direction is right next to you?

I'm right with you on voting a loud NO if it's going to be everyone shoulder-to-shoulder. The primary draft person or duo HAS to have the space needed. If the rest can fit, then I'm okay with it... fair enough burden to put on Greg?

Dave

eddiejag · Post by **eddiejag** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 5:37 am

King i do remember that conflict , and it was quite scarry.I also remember team b was a pretty big dude, and team a looked like a dwarf compared to b. I also thought team b got screwed on not being able to bid. Everybody on your side confirmed he said 7.But team A said thats it your to late, and the auctioneer agreed with him. Something like that team B should have been offerd to go 8 or get out.Just the way team A conducted him self really pissed off B. I still think team B was more mad at A, [ the way he handled himself ] then actually losing lee. What would have happend if that guy freaked out. You really might consider having security at these events.We would have had to stop it, and who knows what would have happend. This might be a good topic to bring up, and case this happens in the future.

Dyv · Post by **Dyv** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 5:43 am

Originally posted by eddiejag:

King i do remember that conflict , and it was quite scarry.I also remember team b was a pretty big dude, and team a looked like a dwarf compared to b. I also thought team b got screwed on not being able to bid. Everybody on your side confirmed he said 7.But team A said thats it your to late, and the auctioneer agreed with him. Something like that team B should have been offerd to go 8 or get out.Just the way team A conducted him self really pissed off B. I still think team B was more mad at A, [ the way he handled himself ] then actually losing lee. What would have happend if that guy freaked out. You really might consider having security at these events.We would have had to stop it, and who knows what would have happend. This might be a good topic to bring up, and case this happens in the future. How about a new rule?

If you're a friggin' psycho with a bad temper and a mean streak please don't play!

The Lollygaggers · Post by **The Lollygaggers** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 5:46 am

Dyv - It seems to me that once you've got rows of owners, it's gone too far. And what's the upper limit on owners? Should we allow more than 3?

As an aside, if you move the tables further back, visibility of the draft board becomes an issue. Of course, I suppose you could nix the draft boards and use giant projector screens instead. That way, each team of up to 20 co-owners could assemble convention-style at assigned spots in the room.

Dyv · Post by **Dyv** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 5:53 am

Originally posted by Maroon and White:

Dyv - It seems to me that once you've got rows of owners, it's gone too far. And what's the upper limit on owners? Should we allow more than 3?

As an aside, if you move the tables further back, visibility of the draft board becomes an issue. Of course, I suppose you could nix the draft boards and use giant projector screens instead. That way, each team of up to 20 co-owners could assemble convention-style at assigned spots in the room. Sweet! We can get David Stern to call each team to send a rep up and make a pick one at a time...

LOL

Your point(s) are well made

Dave

Sack · Post by **Sack** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 11:17 am

I've got a THIRD person involved in my ULTIMATE team so I wanted to consider this question a bit longer prior to answering. Adding a chair or making space at the table just doesn't sit well. Having taken part in the several of these draft leagues in both baseball and football, I think we are better served sticking to TWO people. Don't want an audience as I've seen first hand how a " crowd" of people can get out of hand, especially for a 4+ hour draft/auction. Let those that put up the 5K have the space. The "outsiders" can read about it and if they really want to take part let them fork over the SHEETS in the future. As far as CELL PHONES, I'd vote them out as well. Handle the draft/auction yourself and check your messages at the break.

sandckaye · Post by **sandckaye** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 1:44 pm

I really dont understand the objection to a 3rd person for the ultimate draft because we will have the entire room to ourselves. We will not have any problem spreading out. I do agree on just 2 for the main event. That could get crowed.and I would agree on NO cell phones allowed

Stan

Nevadaman · Post by **Nevadaman** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 2:57 pm

Am I missing something here? I don't understand the idea that we will somehow have more room at the Ultimate Draft. I don't care if the room is empty. The room is not the issue - table space is the issue. Are we going to have special tables made for the Ultimate? If not, the table space will be exactly the same as the Main Event. Therefore, I still feel NO 3rd person. No cell phones.

sandckaye · Post by **sandckaye** » Sat Jan 15, 2005 12:34 am

The tables are set up for 15 teams. I dont think we all have to sit at one table. I dont think they would mind leaving 2 or 3 tables in the room for us allowing us to spread out.

Stan

Nevadaman · Post by **Nevadaman** » Sat Jan 15, 2005 5:38 am

I don't see that working at all. You're thinking that the 3 person teams will sit maybe 10 feet away from the table at an adjoining table? My point was and is that there isn't room for 3 people AT the table. Further, I don't see how we can conduct a draft with certain teams all over the place. It will get disorganized or worse. I could maybe tolerate a 3rd person who remains 10 feet away from all players and never interacts with the table at any time, except during breaks. That way they could experience the draft, but just couldn't participate in it. (This would go for the Ultimate only, not the Main Event.)

Dyv · Post by **Dyv** » Sat Jan 15, 2005 11:44 am

Originally posted by Nevadaman:

I don't see that working at all. You're thinking that the 3 person teams will sit maybe 10 feet away from the table at an adjoining table? My point was and is that there isn't room for 3 people AT the table. Further, I don't see how we can conduct a draft with certain teams all over the place. It will get disorganized or worse. I could maybe tolerate a 3rd person who remains 10 feet away from all players and never interacts with the table at any time, except during breaks. That way they could experience the draft, but just couldn't participate in it. (This would go for the Ultimate only, not the Main Event.) Nevada, what if my 3 man team wants to have 1 person at the table or in fact what if we want to sit 10 feet back at our own table and spread out? We can easily track the picks by ourselves (I don't need the board) by filling out our own grid and then when it's our turn we'll walk up and make a pick from our 'spot'

Do you have a problem with that if we want to move around? Are you going to mandate I have to sit in my spot? We'll have a room the size of half a football field and plenty of space without changing the tables whatsoever.

Dyv

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Sat Jan 15, 2005 11:52 am

Originally posted by Nevadaman:

I don't see that working at all. You're thinking that the 3 person teams will sit maybe 10 feet away from the table at an adjoining table? My point was and is that there isn't room for 3 people AT the table. Further, I don't see how we can conduct a draft with certain teams all over the place. It will get disorganized or worse. I could maybe tolerate a 3rd person who remains 10 feet away from all players and never interacts with the table at any time, except during breaks. That way they could experience the draft, but just couldn't participate in it. (This would go for the Ultimate only, not the Main Event.) Well, that is the idea I proposed from the get-go for the main event and the Ultimate. A third member is allowed to sit in a chair well back of his teammates, but at least in view of the draft boards. Honestly, I think you're talking about a handful to a dozen teams that would like to have a third member present, not 50% of the teams. And they'd have to request this through me, so I'd know who every team is and they'd know what is required of that third team member. It definitely wouldn't be a third member at the draft table, trust me on that.

I won't do this if there's a major concern, but I was letting people know I was considering it and would make sure it's under control if we did it.

Nevadaman · Post by **Nevadaman** » Sat Jan 15, 2005 12:00 pm

Greg, the key words in regard to the third person are "well back" of the table. My assumption initially, the way the posts were going, was that the third person would be right in back of the other two. The difference is crucial. I could live with "well back". I still oppose cell phones!

751542 · Post by **751542** » Sat Jan 15, 2005 12:39 pm

i have no problem with 3 people. i would rather have 3 in the room per team than cell phones. no cells please. pony up and make it to the draft. RT

Balticsquids · Post by **Balticsquids** » Sat Jan 15, 2005 1:35 pm

Greg, im not in the ulti. ...... but i think all or just about all members agree, cell phones MUST be banned . i think from all events period know matter what the stakes or cash ...NO CELL PHONES IN NFBC events period

Dyv · Post by **Dyv** » Sat Jan 15, 2005 1:46 pm

Originally posted by Balticsquids:

Greg, im not in the ulti. ...... but i think all or just about all members agree, cell phones MUST be banned . i think from all events period know matter what the stakes or cash ...NO CELL PHONES IN NFBC events period Time to buy a cellphone jammer and bring it with me to the draft

devilznj · Post by **devilznj** » Sat Jan 15, 2005 5:34 pm

How about taking a vote of all paid members on March 1 to determine if cell phones are allowed? From what I'm hearing seems like alot of people are anti-cell phone (as am I).

Plymouth · Post by **Plymouth** » Tue Jan 18, 2005 2:06 am

When defeat comes, accept it as a signal that your plans are not sound. Rebuild those plans and set sail once more toward your coveted goal.

-- Napoleon Hill

RichV · Post by **RichV** » Tue Jan 18, 2005 6:25 am

I'm all for a cell phone ban at the draft tables as well. Make your calls, get your advice during the breaks.

Brian Walton · Post by **Brian Walton** » Tue Jan 18, 2005 11:00 am

Two drafters last year, three this year and four next? Give me a break. Where does it end? If that many people need to be involved, pay for two teams.

If you were to poll the majority of the players, not just those who agitate for change, they would likely vote down these extreme ideas. That includes use of cell phones in the draft room, which completely goes against common courtesy.

Gordon Gekko · Post by **Gordon Gekko** » Tue Jan 18, 2005 11:35 am

Originally posted by brian:

That includes use of cell phones in the draft room, which completely goes against common courtesy. can we also ban owners that smell, fart, burp, spill their beer on your cheatsheets, take up extra space, talk to loud, etc... thanks

nydownunder · Post by **nydownunder** » Wed Jan 26, 2005 2:08 pm

RE: 3rd Team Member

1) Its hard to believe that any third person in such a competitive event will not become involved and I doubt there will be anyone there to monitor this FAIRLY. It will put the Cliff Lee argument to shame.

2) Because of point 1, such teams will gain advantages. I think each additional team member, although at a diminishing rate, will add incremental advantages to that team. I can think of a few very miniscule tasks that a 3rd member could do that would be valuable in freeing up the 2nd member to take on more research/analytic roles.

3) Bending draft rules (or creating ones that can't/aren't enforcable) will be its demise.

RE: Cell phones = Mistakes The more the merrier!

BigalupaBarntool's · Post by **BigalupaBarntool's** » Sun Jan 30, 2005 2:16 pm

The Yearick boys are in favor of 3 at the draft. The Yearick boys are not in favor of the $50 levy. The third brother will bring his own water bottle.

We like Dyv's idea of every other team sitting on the other side of the table.

Speaking as one of the, what sounds like, few 3 man teams, any help that our 3rd member gives will be quiet comic relief and moral support. We plan on bringing a laptop and a few fantasypsportsmag.com cheat sheets. It'll be our first trip to Vegas and if one of us has to ditch for 5 hours, that will really put a crimp on our fellwoship.

Thanks.

alexado · Post by **alexado** » Sun Jan 30, 2005 2:53 pm

I'm against allowing more than 2 people per team at the draft. When I signed up the existing rules stated either 1 or 2 Owners per team. Any rule changes can be implemented before the start of next years draft.

ToddZ · Post by **ToddZ** » Sun Jan 30, 2005 2:58 pm

can we also ban owners that smell, fart, burp, spill their beer on your cheatsheets, take up extra space, talk to loud, etc Looks like it's off to the WCOFB for me....