Level playing field = same information avaliable for all playing in the main event. Doesn't mean they have to spoon feed everyone the latest twits...but announcing starting positions and starting closers, etc, plus injuries happening in those 7 days do alter things.
If you enjoy starting a main event off on an uneven level...than admit to it. Make me laugh at all of the once touted "sacred" things that have been flushed away. Starting the freaking DRAFTS off at the same time east coast to west??? Like THAT matters now??? Let us freaking sleep in in Vegas for crying out loud. It is pointless now.
If that is too hard to understand...I give up.
If A-rod's season ending injury was absolutely hiden from the public for 7 days...and the folks drafting in week 2 also drafted him in the first round as a healthy player...the overall playing field for the main event prize would indeed be level.
If not...you are spinning bullshit once again.
[ October 09, 2009, 11:12 PM: Message edited by: sportsbettingman ]
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
-
sportsbettingman
- Posts: 3038
- Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:00 pm
- Contact:
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
"The only reason for time is so that everything doesn't happen at once."
~Albert Einstein
~Albert Einstein
-
Liquidhippo
- Posts: 357
- Joined: Wed May 12, 2004 6:00 pm
- Contact:
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
I applaud everything new Greg has presented here. I also am completely baffled at at the amount of backlash expressed on these boards to what he's presented. I just don't get it. NFBC weekend is awesome, but it only comes once a year. I blink and it's over and it's time to leave. I'm left wanting more. Well, more has arrived! It's not diluted for me, not even slightly. Everyone has their preferences about this and that, and that's fine. For me...100 people in the draft room, 200, 300, 1,000. What ev, it matters not. I'm there to win the loot, or at least try. There will be good times and friends there both weekends. Bring it on! Too much is never enough!
[ October 09, 2009, 11:36 PM: Message edited by: Liquidhippo ]
[ October 09, 2009, 11:36 PM: Message edited by: Liquidhippo ]
-
Ryan E. Houston
- Posts: 132
- Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2009 6:00 pm
- Contact:
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Originally posted by huskyfan88:
quote:Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:
quote:Originally posted by huskyfan88:
Whatever happens, happens. These are just going to be Fanball leagues now. Now this helps the conversation. Thanks. [/QUOTE]They did pay big bucks for this, did they not? Don't tell me they aren't going to call the shots. i.e. maximize their return on investment. [/QUOTE]I don't think this is a fair shot at all. We all talked about what to do to improve on these events and this was something we all discussed. Sure, we knew that some would hate it. But some would hate the mixed format in the Auction Championship as well. No matter what we do -- Greg / Tom are vital to the decision making.
Don't believe that we just came in and made some arbitrary decision without asking Greg / Tom their opinion. That's not fair and it's not true.
You are right -- we bought it and we want to grow it. I think thats the goal of any business. But to believe we are making these decisions without you guys in mind -- is just not true.
What we've found running FFOC and FANBALL is that people have stuff going on in their lives that preclude them from taking part in one weekend. We need to spread that around. That is exactly what we are doing.
We are getting WAY too tied up in this double entry thing because it was never the intention.
We want to get to 405. Hell -- we'd love to get to 810. I have no idea when that will happen, but giving people the ability to pick the time that works best for their schedule is the first step.
We are prepared to lose money on the first weekend if nobody goes. We understand the ramifications of this. We aren't stupid. We believe we will get a good group on that weekend and we will get plenty the weekend after.
It may change in the future -- but right now we want to test how this will impact the live events business. If it's a failure -- that's on me and I take full responsibility for that.
However, I think we are all missing the rationale -- you still have to beat 404 teams to win the NFFC and that HAS NOT CHANGED regardless of how many owners have multiple teams.
quote:Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:
quote:Originally posted by huskyfan88:
Whatever happens, happens. These are just going to be Fanball leagues now. Now this helps the conversation. Thanks. [/QUOTE]They did pay big bucks for this, did they not? Don't tell me they aren't going to call the shots. i.e. maximize their return on investment. [/QUOTE]I don't think this is a fair shot at all. We all talked about what to do to improve on these events and this was something we all discussed. Sure, we knew that some would hate it. But some would hate the mixed format in the Auction Championship as well. No matter what we do -- Greg / Tom are vital to the decision making.
Don't believe that we just came in and made some arbitrary decision without asking Greg / Tom their opinion. That's not fair and it's not true.
You are right -- we bought it and we want to grow it. I think thats the goal of any business. But to believe we are making these decisions without you guys in mind -- is just not true.
What we've found running FFOC and FANBALL is that people have stuff going on in their lives that preclude them from taking part in one weekend. We need to spread that around. That is exactly what we are doing.
We are getting WAY too tied up in this double entry thing because it was never the intention.
We want to get to 405. Hell -- we'd love to get to 810. I have no idea when that will happen, but giving people the ability to pick the time that works best for their schedule is the first step.
We are prepared to lose money on the first weekend if nobody goes. We understand the ramifications of this. We aren't stupid. We believe we will get a good group on that weekend and we will get plenty the weekend after.
It may change in the future -- but right now we want to test how this will impact the live events business. If it's a failure -- that's on me and I take full responsibility for that.
However, I think we are all missing the rationale -- you still have to beat 404 teams to win the NFFC and that HAS NOT CHANGED regardless of how many owners have multiple teams.
-
Ryan E. Houston
- Posts: 132
- Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2009 6:00 pm
- Contact:
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Originally posted by Chest Rockwell:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Captain Crunch:
[qb] ... and wtf does earning a badge to a vip party have to do with anything? I'd be looking forward to meeting people that I've competed against for years - who cares about the schmoozers. What a ridiculous interjection. I truly appreciate the passion that has been brought out by this thread. It tells me you all care and that's important.
If my "VIP" concept was out of line -- that's fine. Some may view it like that -- but you also haven't looked at the 25+ PMs that are sitting in my inbox from people trying to figure out how to get their hands on one of those.
So while you all are passionate about double weekends, double entries, start times, etc. There is an entirely different set of guys who care about things like where this draft is going to take place, the festivities and stuff like VIP passes.
Greg was feeling pretty beat up over this and I wanted to ensure you all that there are PLENTY of things you haven't heard about yet... VIP Packages being of them.
Regardless -- let's continue to be passionate, give our perspectives (both good and bad) and continue to use this thread as a sounding board to ensure that we are all heard.
After all -- that's the goal.
I sincerely appreciate the passion.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Captain Crunch:
[qb] ... and wtf does earning a badge to a vip party have to do with anything? I'd be looking forward to meeting people that I've competed against for years - who cares about the schmoozers. What a ridiculous interjection. I truly appreciate the passion that has been brought out by this thread. It tells me you all care and that's important.
If my "VIP" concept was out of line -- that's fine. Some may view it like that -- but you also haven't looked at the 25+ PMs that are sitting in my inbox from people trying to figure out how to get their hands on one of those.
So while you all are passionate about double weekends, double entries, start times, etc. There is an entirely different set of guys who care about things like where this draft is going to take place, the festivities and stuff like VIP passes.
Greg was feeling pretty beat up over this and I wanted to ensure you all that there are PLENTY of things you haven't heard about yet... VIP Packages being of them.
Regardless -- let's continue to be passionate, give our perspectives (both good and bad) and continue to use this thread as a sounding board to ensure that we are all heard.
After all -- that's the goal.
I sincerely appreciate the passion.
-
sportsbettingman
- Posts: 3038
- Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:00 pm
- Contact:
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
If you edited out just one condescending remark from each of your posts, Ryan...you'd be way better off.
You need a post editor!
You need a post editor!
"The only reason for time is so that everything doesn't happen at once."
~Albert Einstein
~Albert Einstein
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Originally posted by sportsbettingman:
If A-rod's season ending injury was absolutely hiden from the public for 7 days...and the folks drafting in week 2 also drafted him in the first round as a healthy player...the overall playing field for the main event prize would indeed be level.
Equal opportunity makes for a level playing field, not equal outcomes. No league in the main event is equal. Some are stacked with really good players and some aren't. Luck of the draw. Drafting a guy who gets injured is no different.
If A-rod's season ending injury was absolutely hiden from the public for 7 days...and the folks drafting in week 2 also drafted him in the first round as a healthy player...the overall playing field for the main event prize would indeed be level.
Equal opportunity makes for a level playing field, not equal outcomes. No league in the main event is equal. Some are stacked with really good players and some aren't. Luck of the draw. Drafting a guy who gets injured is no different.
-
sportsbettingman
- Posts: 3038
- Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:00 pm
- Contact:
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Ryan "E" Houston...like there were so many Ryan Houstons on this message board THAT was needed. :rolleyes: Someone has issues.
"I get it. Change is never a good thing and people like to tell you why ".
"The ? you should all be asking --
How do you earn one of these:" (A blatent misdirect in the middle of a passionate debate...you underestimate the folks here.) You can't jiggle a keychain and expect everyone to look the other way.
"We are getting WAY too tied up in this double entry thing because it was never the intention." I'll give you the benefit of the doubt here...but I doubt anyway. I'd bet next season you DO NOT RUN TWO DRAFT WEEKENDS for the main event...you know it, I know it. It's just this years mess being spin dried.
"If my "VIP" concept was out of line -- that's fine. Some may view it like that -- but you also haven't looked at the 25+ PMs that are sitting in my inbox from people trying to figure out how to get their hands on one of those." (Totally self serving remark...have you replied to those PM's yet, or are they still sitting there?)
WOW...It's WCORP on the left, and now WCORPBALL on the right.
Nice evolution.
Tell me the payout percentages planned for the Fanball NFBC? You plan on skimming more than $20 of every $100 to put on a good show?
[ October 10, 2009, 12:45 AM: Message edited by: sportsbettingman ]
"I get it. Change is never a good thing and people like to tell you why ".
"The ? you should all be asking --
How do you earn one of these:" (A blatent misdirect in the middle of a passionate debate...you underestimate the folks here.) You can't jiggle a keychain and expect everyone to look the other way.
"We are getting WAY too tied up in this double entry thing because it was never the intention." I'll give you the benefit of the doubt here...but I doubt anyway. I'd bet next season you DO NOT RUN TWO DRAFT WEEKENDS for the main event...you know it, I know it. It's just this years mess being spin dried.
"If my "VIP" concept was out of line -- that's fine. Some may view it like that -- but you also haven't looked at the 25+ PMs that are sitting in my inbox from people trying to figure out how to get their hands on one of those." (Totally self serving remark...have you replied to those PM's yet, or are they still sitting there?)
WOW...It's WCORP on the left, and now WCORPBALL on the right.
Nice evolution.
Tell me the payout percentages planned for the Fanball NFBC? You plan on skimming more than $20 of every $100 to put on a good show?
[ October 10, 2009, 12:45 AM: Message edited by: sportsbettingman ]
"The only reason for time is so that everything doesn't happen at once."
~Albert Einstein
~Albert Einstein
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Originally posted by Liquidhippo:
I applaud everything new Greg has presented here. I also am completely baffled at at the amount of backlash expressed on these boards to what he's presented. I just don't get it. NFBC weekend is awesome, but it only comes once a year. I blink and it's over and it's time to leave. I'm left wanting more. Well, more has arrived! It's not diluted for me, not even slightly. Everyone has their preferences about this and that, and that's fine. For me...100 people in the draft room, 200, 300, 1,000. What ev, it matters not. I'm there to win the loot, or at least try. There will be good times and friends there both weekends. Bring it on! Too much is never enough! Good perspective Greg. Sounds like it was written by someone who loves a challenge rather than someone who is looking for an excuse on why they're going to lose 6 months before draft day.
I applaud everything new Greg has presented here. I also am completely baffled at at the amount of backlash expressed on these boards to what he's presented. I just don't get it. NFBC weekend is awesome, but it only comes once a year. I blink and it's over and it's time to leave. I'm left wanting more. Well, more has arrived! It's not diluted for me, not even slightly. Everyone has their preferences about this and that, and that's fine. For me...100 people in the draft room, 200, 300, 1,000. What ev, it matters not. I'm there to win the loot, or at least try. There will be good times and friends there both weekends. Bring it on! Too much is never enough! Good perspective Greg. Sounds like it was written by someone who loves a challenge rather than someone who is looking for an excuse on why they're going to lose 6 months before draft day.
-
sportsbettingman
- Posts: 3038
- Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:00 pm
- Contact:
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Originally posted by KJ Duke:
quote:Originally posted by Liquidhippo:
I applaud everything new Greg has presented here. I also am completely baffled at at the amount of backlash expressed on these boards to what he's presented. I just don't get it. NFBC weekend is awesome, but it only comes once a year. I blink and it's over and it's time to leave. I'm left wanting more. Well, more has arrived! It's not diluted for me, not even slightly. Everyone has their preferences about this and that, and that's fine. For me...100 people in the draft room, 200, 300, 1,000. What ev, it matters not. I'm there to win the loot, or at least try. There will be good times and friends there both weekends. Bring it on! Too much is never enough! Good perspective Greg. Sounds like it was written by someone who loves a challenge rather than someone who is looking for an excuse on why they're going to lose 6 months before draft day. [/QUOTE]I know I was in the black this baseball season...how about you Kevin?
quote:Originally posted by Liquidhippo:
I applaud everything new Greg has presented here. I also am completely baffled at at the amount of backlash expressed on these boards to what he's presented. I just don't get it. NFBC weekend is awesome, but it only comes once a year. I blink and it's over and it's time to leave. I'm left wanting more. Well, more has arrived! It's not diluted for me, not even slightly. Everyone has their preferences about this and that, and that's fine. For me...100 people in the draft room, 200, 300, 1,000. What ev, it matters not. I'm there to win the loot, or at least try. There will be good times and friends there both weekends. Bring it on! Too much is never enough! Good perspective Greg. Sounds like it was written by someone who loves a challenge rather than someone who is looking for an excuse on why they're going to lose 6 months before draft day.
[/QUOTE]I know I was in the black this baseball season...how about you Kevin? "The only reason for time is so that everything doesn't happen at once."
~Albert Einstein
~Albert Einstein
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Originally posted by sportsbettingman:
quote:Originally posted by KJ Duke:
quote:Originally posted by Liquidhippo:
I applaud everything new Greg has presented here. I also am completely baffled at at the amount of backlash expressed on these boards to what he's presented. I just don't get it. NFBC weekend is awesome, but it only comes once a year. I blink and it's over and it's time to leave. I'm left wanting more. Well, more has arrived! It's not diluted for me, not even slightly. Everyone has their preferences about this and that, and that's fine. For me...100 people in the draft room, 200, 300, 1,000. What ev, it matters not. I'm there to win the loot, or at least try. There will be good times and friends there both weekends. Bring it on! Too much is never enough! Good perspective Greg. Sounds like it was written by someone who loves a challenge rather than someone who is looking for an excuse on why they're going to lose 6 months before draft day. [/QUOTE]I know I was in the black this baseball season...how about you Kevin? [/QUOTE]Worst season ever Lance - 3rd, 4th and 5th place finishes everywhere I look with a couple of extra crappy teams thrown in. Thanks for asking. Doesn't mean I'm not ready for the challenge next season. 
Fortunately football is off to a great start across the board.
[ October 10, 2009, 12:52 AM: Message edited by: KJ Duke ]
quote:Originally posted by KJ Duke:
quote:Originally posted by Liquidhippo:
I applaud everything new Greg has presented here. I also am completely baffled at at the amount of backlash expressed on these boards to what he's presented. I just don't get it. NFBC weekend is awesome, but it only comes once a year. I blink and it's over and it's time to leave. I'm left wanting more. Well, more has arrived! It's not diluted for me, not even slightly. Everyone has their preferences about this and that, and that's fine. For me...100 people in the draft room, 200, 300, 1,000. What ev, it matters not. I'm there to win the loot, or at least try. There will be good times and friends there both weekends. Bring it on! Too much is never enough! Good perspective Greg. Sounds like it was written by someone who loves a challenge rather than someone who is looking for an excuse on why they're going to lose 6 months before draft day.
[/QUOTE]I know I was in the black this baseball season...how about you Kevin? [/QUOTE]Worst season ever Lance - 3rd, 4th and 5th place finishes everywhere I look with a couple of extra crappy teams thrown in. Thanks for asking. Doesn't mean I'm not ready for the challenge next season. Fortunately football is off to a great start across the board.
[ October 10, 2009, 12:52 AM: Message edited by: KJ Duke ]
-
ZackPhilly
- Posts: 22
- Joined: Mon Jan 16, 2006 6:00 pm
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Interesting discussions as usual.
Greg - you and your team have earned and deserve a ton of respect for your work. Just because individuals may not agree with a decision (for which the opinion was asked) doesn't mean your doing any less stellar a job.
I believe your Q's are (w/executive summary answer after):
Date change thoughts? Fine with me.
Two weekend Main event thoughts? Prefer not to.
Multiple entries from single owners thoughts (added in process)? Sucks, please don't allow.
**************************************
Additional Comment:
I prefer the Main Event on one weekend at the same time in each location, with "one" team per owner predominantly because its "cool" and "prestigious". I can live with multiple weekends to grow the NFBC, it just lowers the prestige level for me. I also agree the one start time can be dropped as it will not carry any prestige with multiple weekends.
I despise the option of multiple entries for one owner in the main event. Even if syndicates do exist (I don't like that either), it hurts the prestige of the event for me.
The $350 entry, multi-day, no face time, multi-entry owners, 12T Online contest is "different". I do not wish to denigrate that contest but it will not hold the same prestige as long as the $ investment, payoff, and "odds" within specific event contestants (for lack of better description) are not equivalent or better for all contestants.
You have built up a prestigious NFBC Main Event brand recognition over the years, somewhat tainted by the 12T online "version" where competitors can have an "NFBC" team that isn't as challenging as a 15T league. Pardon me if I wince when an NFBC online competitor shares in this NFBC brand recognition as the most competitive large participant/high payoff fantasy baseball event in the country. Much as I would think Ultimate League competitors may wince when a Main Event competitor talks about paying $1300 for an entry being such an investment. Part of that brand recognition is the perception that a singular draft date at a singular draft time precludes anyone from somehow having more information than others.
I want to be part of the prestigious special event that is the Main Event and I won't be thrilled with anything that takes away from that. I will also be greedy in thinking a 1/300 or 1/390 chance is better than a 1/405. It doesn't make it a good decision for the NFBC events, it's just my myopic view.
You've earned the respect of most of the participants and I would guess many will have the "if its good enough for Greg and his guys, its good enough for me". You and your team have earned the right to make the big picture decisions. I just want the best event, not just good enough. I think you do as well, just from the overall perspective.
Any chance of enabling polls on the forum and sending out an e-mail to NFBC Main Event participants to show % voted and for what outcome?
Hav fun.
Greg - you and your team have earned and deserve a ton of respect for your work. Just because individuals may not agree with a decision (for which the opinion was asked) doesn't mean your doing any less stellar a job.
I believe your Q's are (w/executive summary answer after):
Date change thoughts? Fine with me.
Two weekend Main event thoughts? Prefer not to.
Multiple entries from single owners thoughts (added in process)? Sucks, please don't allow.
**************************************
Additional Comment:
I prefer the Main Event on one weekend at the same time in each location, with "one" team per owner predominantly because its "cool" and "prestigious". I can live with multiple weekends to grow the NFBC, it just lowers the prestige level for me. I also agree the one start time can be dropped as it will not carry any prestige with multiple weekends.
I despise the option of multiple entries for one owner in the main event. Even if syndicates do exist (I don't like that either), it hurts the prestige of the event for me.
The $350 entry, multi-day, no face time, multi-entry owners, 12T Online contest is "different". I do not wish to denigrate that contest but it will not hold the same prestige as long as the $ investment, payoff, and "odds" within specific event contestants (for lack of better description) are not equivalent or better for all contestants.
You have built up a prestigious NFBC Main Event brand recognition over the years, somewhat tainted by the 12T online "version" where competitors can have an "NFBC" team that isn't as challenging as a 15T league. Pardon me if I wince when an NFBC online competitor shares in this NFBC brand recognition as the most competitive large participant/high payoff fantasy baseball event in the country. Much as I would think Ultimate League competitors may wince when a Main Event competitor talks about paying $1300 for an entry being such an investment. Part of that brand recognition is the perception that a singular draft date at a singular draft time precludes anyone from somehow having more information than others.
I want to be part of the prestigious special event that is the Main Event and I won't be thrilled with anything that takes away from that. I will also be greedy in thinking a 1/300 or 1/390 chance is better than a 1/405. It doesn't make it a good decision for the NFBC events, it's just my myopic view.
You've earned the respect of most of the participants and I would guess many will have the "if its good enough for Greg and his guys, its good enough for me". You and your team have earned the right to make the big picture decisions. I just want the best event, not just good enough. I think you do as well, just from the overall perspective.
Any chance of enabling polls on the forum and sending out an e-mail to NFBC Main Event participants to show % voted and for what outcome?
Hav fun.
-
The Mighty Men
- Posts: 930
- Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2006 6:00 pm
- Contact:
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Originally posted by Walla Walla:
I'll be pulling out. I'm sad to see Greg let the other contest make the date. One weekend with the best players in the land was a great thing. Now
many of those players will never draft together again. This really SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!
**** YOU FANBALL!!!!! This is for real this time, right? No more false bluffs out of you?
I'll be pulling out. I'm sad to see Greg let the other contest make the date. One weekend with the best players in the land was a great thing. Now
many of those players will never draft together again. This really SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!
**** YOU FANBALL!!!!! This is for real this time, right? No more false bluffs out of you?
Who is this, robed in splendor, striding forward in the greatness of his strength? “It is I, proclaiming victory, mighty to save.” Isaiah 63:1
-
Greg Ambrosius
- Posts: 41090
- Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2004 6:00 pm
- Contact:
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Originally posted by ZackPhilly:
Interesting discussions as usual.
Greg - you and your team have earned and deserve a ton of respect for your work. Just because individuals may not agree with a decision (for which the opinion was asked) doesn't mean your doing any less stellar a job.
I believe your Q's are (w/executive summary answer after):
Date change thoughts? Fine with me.
Two weekend Main event thoughts? Prefer not to.
Multiple entries from single owners thoughts (added in process)? Sucks, please don't allow.
**************************************
Thanks Zack and thanks everyone for your passionate responses, good and bad towards me and the Fanball/NFBC team. We appreciate all of the thoughts and we'll make final decisions accordingly. We still have a lot of work to do with the hotels in each of the cities and will work accordingly to grow this event and still make it as special as everyone wants.
I think a few good things I can take from these first 16 pages is that:
a) change of draft date from the third weekend in March to the final weekend isn't an issue with too many folks, although we haven't heard from all of the guys who have local league drafts that weekend.
b) EVERYONE wants that Draft Day to be as special as it's always been. Got it. We plan on making it more special. Everyone should plan on drafting that second weekend then and nothing will change. But for some folks who can't make that weekend and enjoy the entire March Madness experience in Las Vegas or want to draft twice, we've offered the extra weekend.
c) Some folks HATE the idea of allowing folks two entries in the main event. Some folks are excited by it. Some see advantages for those teams, some see disadvantages for them. This appears to be the biggest rage of debate over our plan.
Outside of some folks just being themselves with certain posts, this has been extremely helpful. Keep the posts coming and we'll respond when questions are asked and finalize everything soon. Thanks all.
Interesting discussions as usual.
Greg - you and your team have earned and deserve a ton of respect for your work. Just because individuals may not agree with a decision (for which the opinion was asked) doesn't mean your doing any less stellar a job.
I believe your Q's are (w/executive summary answer after):
Date change thoughts? Fine with me.
Two weekend Main event thoughts? Prefer not to.
Multiple entries from single owners thoughts (added in process)? Sucks, please don't allow.
**************************************
Thanks Zack and thanks everyone for your passionate responses, good and bad towards me and the Fanball/NFBC team. We appreciate all of the thoughts and we'll make final decisions accordingly. We still have a lot of work to do with the hotels in each of the cities and will work accordingly to grow this event and still make it as special as everyone wants.
I think a few good things I can take from these first 16 pages is that:
a) change of draft date from the third weekend in March to the final weekend isn't an issue with too many folks, although we haven't heard from all of the guys who have local league drafts that weekend.
b) EVERYONE wants that Draft Day to be as special as it's always been. Got it. We plan on making it more special. Everyone should plan on drafting that second weekend then and nothing will change. But for some folks who can't make that weekend and enjoy the entire March Madness experience in Las Vegas or want to draft twice, we've offered the extra weekend.
c) Some folks HATE the idea of allowing folks two entries in the main event. Some folks are excited by it. Some see advantages for those teams, some see disadvantages for them. This appears to be the biggest rage of debate over our plan.
Outside of some folks just being themselves with certain posts, this has been extremely helpful. Keep the posts coming and we'll respond when questions are asked and finalize everything soon. Thanks all.
Greg Ambrosius
Founder, National Fantasy Baseball Championship
General Manager, Consumer Fantasy Games at SportsHub Technologies
Twitter - @GregAmbrosius
Founder, National Fantasy Baseball Championship
General Manager, Consumer Fantasy Games at SportsHub Technologies
Twitter - @GregAmbrosius
-
Captain Crunch
- Posts: 64
- Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2008 6:00 pm
- Contact:
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
"If my "VIP" concept was out of line -- that's fine. Some may view it like that -- but you also haven't looked at the 25+ PMs that are sitting in my inbox from people trying to figure out how to get their hands on one of those."
Out of line, inappropriate ... and worsened by a patronizing reply. An apology is an absolute thing, and, as such, it must be unconditional: it cannot contain 'ifs' or 'buts'.
As for further comment from me about why the proposed new setup of the main event rankles, why bother? I get the 'message'.
Out of line, inappropriate ... and worsened by a patronizing reply. An apology is an absolute thing, and, as such, it must be unconditional: it cannot contain 'ifs' or 'buts'.
As for further comment from me about why the proposed new setup of the main event rankles, why bother? I get the 'message'.
-
Ryan E. Houston
- Posts: 132
- Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2009 6:00 pm
- Contact:
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Capt. Crunch -
I'm not trying to offend you or anyone else. I understand this is a spirited debate. The entire rational for releasing the VIP concept was to show that we have a ton of new ideas that we want to unveil over the next few days.
And we don't want you to feel that you need to agree with what we are trying to do here. I want your opinion. I want everyone's feedback. I'm inspired by the debate that is raging here because it is the reason why we purchased this company. Passionate fans who care about this product and are very loyal to this company. That's important and very exciting.
Again, I apologize to those who found it offensive or not important but it was not my intention to offend. We are all just very excited about some of the new ideas we have and I thought it would help. An oversight on my part.
Not sure if you saw the other thread about the Diamond League - but we are offering a $10K buy in with a 93.3% payback. That's just one additional idea we are trying to implement.
I appreciate everyone's feedback so keep it coming.
I'm not trying to offend you or anyone else. I understand this is a spirited debate. The entire rational for releasing the VIP concept was to show that we have a ton of new ideas that we want to unveil over the next few days.
And we don't want you to feel that you need to agree with what we are trying to do here. I want your opinion. I want everyone's feedback. I'm inspired by the debate that is raging here because it is the reason why we purchased this company. Passionate fans who care about this product and are very loyal to this company. That's important and very exciting.
Again, I apologize to those who found it offensive or not important but it was not my intention to offend. We are all just very excited about some of the new ideas we have and I thought it would help. An oversight on my part.
Not sure if you saw the other thread about the Diamond League - but we are offering a $10K buy in with a 93.3% payback. That's just one additional idea we are trying to implement.
I appreciate everyone's feedback so keep it coming.
-
Greg Ambrosius
- Posts: 41090
- Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2004 6:00 pm
- Contact:
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Originally posted by sportsbettingman:
WOW...It's WCORP on the left, and now WCORPBALL on the right.
Nice evolution.
Tell me the payout percentages planned for the Fanball NFBC? You plan on skimming more than $20 of every $100 to put on a good show? Lance, I like you, but sometimes I roll my eyes at your posts. I've read all of your WCOFF blasting posts over the years and I'm glad you love the single owner fantasy football league you've embraced now. I get it. I love down-home, Greg & Tom-run leagues, too. Damn, I love the nostagia of Lenny and Emil, Greg & Tom, "got any free drink tickets Greg" days too. I dig it Lance. I dig it that you've taken your shots now at Ryan and me and Corporate America. Cool. Got it.
But here's the real fact of the matter Lance: Lindy Hinkelman probably made more money this year than F+W did through six years of the NFBC. When you consider our Year 1 losses, five years of licensing fees to the MLB Players Association, MLB Advanced Media, no sponsor these last four years for food and beverage while never charging an Events Fee, increased costs of the host hotels from 2004 to 2009 without any increased costs to the participants, a total payout now closer to 80 percent rather than 75 percent in 2004, and the addition of a fourth draft site, well, the costs have eaten into profits while I continued to fight for the players.
Now don't get me wrong, nobody is crying here because each year we have grown in revenue and participants, even in a down economy. But I'll admit this for the first time here: The model didn't make sense to F+W last year and I was mandated to make a change that would have altered the prize money and the future of the NFBC. I refused. I didn't think it was right. Same with the NFFC format. Again, I didn't agree. There is no doubt that contributed to F+W quickly deciding this wasn't the model for them and the eventual sale, thankfully to a fantasy company that understood our model and embraced it.
You and others can rip on Fanball all you want because that's the easy thing to do. But bottom line is that the NFBC wouldn't be here today even in this form without this change. And now we're trying to grow beyond 390 teams and trying a two-weekend concept. Multiple teams are in your favorite football event Lance and every other high-stakes event outside of NFBC and NFFC and nobody is crying that those champions should have asterisks next to their names. So this is new to us, but certainly not new to the industry.
Beyond the main event, we have plans for 10 NFBC Auction Championship leagues and feel we can reach that total with two weekends in one or two cities, but likely not one. We have another live draft announcement coming on Monday that includes another big prize that we feel will be reached with two weekends of drafts, not one. So when you see everything, maybe you'll realize that some folks will come both weekends so that they can compete in everything we are offering. One weekend might not be enough for many of our top players. Let's unveil it all and see if we've added value or killed the main event. Tell us then.
We understand the differences between competing one weekend over the other. I understand it and had reservations about it too. But when looking at the OC results, draft dates didn't seem to matter and the dates that owners chose to draft on were totally in their hands. The leagues were equal for everyone at those times and the competition there is what mattered most. The overall competition has other factors that decide our champion as well, including a) city you draft in; b) league assignments; c) how active your league members are, etc.
We're still the NFBC Lance, not the anti-Christ. But yes, we are part of a bigger fantasy company now. Trust me, the suits at F+W made much scarier demands of me last year that would have made you reach for the tequila immediately. We are in a better boat today, trust me. Tom and I know it first-hand. So let's find a common solution for all of this and continue to work as a passionate family. The other crap doesn't help us grow or make the prize pool grow or, you may hate this but it's the truth, make this event more profitable for our owners. Because again, Lindy made more in 2009 than we did or likely in all the years combined. That's why we were sold.
Carry on all. But again, I can tell you first-hand we are better off today than we could have been. I live in a small town and miss the old days too. I've seen my old company go from 450+ employees in this town of 1,200 to less than 170 now, so don't preach to me about change in Corporate America. I see it firsthand every day. But reality is a bitch sometimes.
Now we find that perfect mix of becoming bigger and more profitable while still keeping the NFBC somewhat like it was before. Does that make any sense?
[ October 10, 2009, 08:39 AM: Message edited by: Greg Ambrosius ]
WOW...It's WCORP on the left, and now WCORPBALL on the right.
Nice evolution.
Tell me the payout percentages planned for the Fanball NFBC? You plan on skimming more than $20 of every $100 to put on a good show? Lance, I like you, but sometimes I roll my eyes at your posts. I've read all of your WCOFF blasting posts over the years and I'm glad you love the single owner fantasy football league you've embraced now. I get it. I love down-home, Greg & Tom-run leagues, too. Damn, I love the nostagia of Lenny and Emil, Greg & Tom, "got any free drink tickets Greg" days too. I dig it Lance. I dig it that you've taken your shots now at Ryan and me and Corporate America. Cool. Got it.
But here's the real fact of the matter Lance: Lindy Hinkelman probably made more money this year than F+W did through six years of the NFBC. When you consider our Year 1 losses, five years of licensing fees to the MLB Players Association, MLB Advanced Media, no sponsor these last four years for food and beverage while never charging an Events Fee, increased costs of the host hotels from 2004 to 2009 without any increased costs to the participants, a total payout now closer to 80 percent rather than 75 percent in 2004, and the addition of a fourth draft site, well, the costs have eaten into profits while I continued to fight for the players.
Now don't get me wrong, nobody is crying here because each year we have grown in revenue and participants, even in a down economy. But I'll admit this for the first time here: The model didn't make sense to F+W last year and I was mandated to make a change that would have altered the prize money and the future of the NFBC. I refused. I didn't think it was right. Same with the NFFC format. Again, I didn't agree. There is no doubt that contributed to F+W quickly deciding this wasn't the model for them and the eventual sale, thankfully to a fantasy company that understood our model and embraced it.
You and others can rip on Fanball all you want because that's the easy thing to do. But bottom line is that the NFBC wouldn't be here today even in this form without this change. And now we're trying to grow beyond 390 teams and trying a two-weekend concept. Multiple teams are in your favorite football event Lance and every other high-stakes event outside of NFBC and NFFC and nobody is crying that those champions should have asterisks next to their names. So this is new to us, but certainly not new to the industry.
Beyond the main event, we have plans for 10 NFBC Auction Championship leagues and feel we can reach that total with two weekends in one or two cities, but likely not one. We have another live draft announcement coming on Monday that includes another big prize that we feel will be reached with two weekends of drafts, not one. So when you see everything, maybe you'll realize that some folks will come both weekends so that they can compete in everything we are offering. One weekend might not be enough for many of our top players. Let's unveil it all and see if we've added value or killed the main event. Tell us then.
We understand the differences between competing one weekend over the other. I understand it and had reservations about it too. But when looking at the OC results, draft dates didn't seem to matter and the dates that owners chose to draft on were totally in their hands. The leagues were equal for everyone at those times and the competition there is what mattered most. The overall competition has other factors that decide our champion as well, including a) city you draft in; b) league assignments; c) how active your league members are, etc.
We're still the NFBC Lance, not the anti-Christ. But yes, we are part of a bigger fantasy company now. Trust me, the suits at F+W made much scarier demands of me last year that would have made you reach for the tequila immediately. We are in a better boat today, trust me. Tom and I know it first-hand. So let's find a common solution for all of this and continue to work as a passionate family. The other crap doesn't help us grow or make the prize pool grow or, you may hate this but it's the truth, make this event more profitable for our owners. Because again, Lindy made more in 2009 than we did or likely in all the years combined. That's why we were sold.
Carry on all. But again, I can tell you first-hand we are better off today than we could have been. I live in a small town and miss the old days too. I've seen my old company go from 450+ employees in this town of 1,200 to less than 170 now, so don't preach to me about change in Corporate America. I see it firsthand every day. But reality is a bitch sometimes.
Now we find that perfect mix of becoming bigger and more profitable while still keeping the NFBC somewhat like it was before. Does that make any sense?
[ October 10, 2009, 08:39 AM: Message edited by: Greg Ambrosius ]
Greg Ambrosius
Founder, National Fantasy Baseball Championship
General Manager, Consumer Fantasy Games at SportsHub Technologies
Twitter - @GregAmbrosius
Founder, National Fantasy Baseball Championship
General Manager, Consumer Fantasy Games at SportsHub Technologies
Twitter - @GregAmbrosius
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
The years I have played in the NFBC, making friends, enjoying competition, and the comraderie, there has always been one constant- Greg will do the right thing.
I can't speak for everyone, just myself, and I know your company bought out the NFBC, Ryan, but you are making a horrific first impression.
Greg has built this event slowly over the years. He has asked for input every step of the way and most of the time he sides with what is right for the contest itself. The trust that he has garnered is the major componant for where the contest is today.
If Greg says two cities and multiple entries will help grow the NFBC, I would back him, because he has earned that trust.
Your posts on the other hand are on the verge of being pompous, arrogant, and elitist. I'm not one that usually throws those terms out there. So far you have had nine or ten posts. None of them reassure players that you want to build this contest slowly and correctly. If anything the opposite is true, it seems that you want to concentrate on "higher end products" such as an MVP party pass or $10,000 leagues.
Your chance for another first impression is gone.
Win us over. Tell us why we should put our trust in you, Ryan E Houston. We don't want promises of a VIP pass, we want to play fantasy baseball at a high level. It's your job to tell us why we should do it with Fanball.
I wish you luck.
I can't speak for everyone, just myself, and I know your company bought out the NFBC, Ryan, but you are making a horrific first impression.
Greg has built this event slowly over the years. He has asked for input every step of the way and most of the time he sides with what is right for the contest itself. The trust that he has garnered is the major componant for where the contest is today.
If Greg says two cities and multiple entries will help grow the NFBC, I would back him, because he has earned that trust.
Your posts on the other hand are on the verge of being pompous, arrogant, and elitist. I'm not one that usually throws those terms out there. So far you have had nine or ten posts. None of them reassure players that you want to build this contest slowly and correctly. If anything the opposite is true, it seems that you want to concentrate on "higher end products" such as an MVP party pass or $10,000 leagues.
Your chance for another first impression is gone.
Win us over. Tell us why we should put our trust in you, Ryan E Houston. We don't want promises of a VIP pass, we want to play fantasy baseball at a high level. It's your job to tell us why we should do it with Fanball.
I wish you luck.
On my tombstone-
Wait! I never had the perfect draft!
Wait! I never had the perfect draft!
-
Chest Rockwell
- Posts: 2400
- Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 6:00 pm
- Contact:
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Originally posted by Ryan E. Houston:
quote:Originally posted by huskyfan88:
quote:Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:
quote:Originally posted by huskyfan88:
Whatever happens, happens. These are just going to be Fanball leagues now. Now this helps the conversation. Thanks. [/QUOTE]They did pay big bucks for this, did they not? Don't tell me they aren't going to call the shots. i.e. maximize their return on investment. [/QUOTE]I don't think this is a fair shot at all. We all talked about what to do to improve on these events and this was something we all discussed. Sure, we knew that some would hate it. But some would hate the mixed format in the Auction Championship as well. No matter what we do -- Greg / Tom are vital to the decision making.
Don't believe that we just came in and made some arbitrary decision without asking Greg / Tom their opinion. That's not fair and it's not true.
You are right -- we bought it and we want to grow it. I think thats the goal of any business. But to believe we are making these decisions without you guys in mind -- is just not true.
What we've found running FFOC and FANBALL is that people have stuff going on in their lives that preclude them from taking part in one weekend. We need to spread that around. That is exactly what we are doing.
We are getting WAY too tied up in this double entry thing because it was never the intention.
We want to get to 405. Hell -- we'd love to get to 810. I have no idea when that will happen, but giving people the ability to pick the time that works best for their schedule is the first step.
We are prepared to lose money on the first weekend if nobody goes. We understand the ramifications of this. We aren't stupid. We believe we will get a good group on that weekend and we will get plenty the weekend after.
It may change in the future -- but right now we want to test how this will impact the live events business. If it's a failure -- that's on me and I take full responsibility for that.
However, I think we are all missing the rationale -- you still have to beat 404 teams to win the NFFC and that HAS NOT CHANGED regardless of how many owners have multiple teams. [/QUOTE]FOR GOODNESS SAKES THAT IS THE 3RD TIME IN A POST YOU HAVE REFERRED TO IT AS THE NFFC. IT IS THE NFBC!
quote:Originally posted by huskyfan88:
quote:Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:
quote:Originally posted by huskyfan88:
Whatever happens, happens. These are just going to be Fanball leagues now. Now this helps the conversation. Thanks. [/QUOTE]They did pay big bucks for this, did they not? Don't tell me they aren't going to call the shots. i.e. maximize their return on investment. [/QUOTE]I don't think this is a fair shot at all. We all talked about what to do to improve on these events and this was something we all discussed. Sure, we knew that some would hate it. But some would hate the mixed format in the Auction Championship as well. No matter what we do -- Greg / Tom are vital to the decision making.
Don't believe that we just came in and made some arbitrary decision without asking Greg / Tom their opinion. That's not fair and it's not true.
You are right -- we bought it and we want to grow it. I think thats the goal of any business. But to believe we are making these decisions without you guys in mind -- is just not true.
What we've found running FFOC and FANBALL is that people have stuff going on in their lives that preclude them from taking part in one weekend. We need to spread that around. That is exactly what we are doing.
We are getting WAY too tied up in this double entry thing because it was never the intention.
We want to get to 405. Hell -- we'd love to get to 810. I have no idea when that will happen, but giving people the ability to pick the time that works best for their schedule is the first step.
We are prepared to lose money on the first weekend if nobody goes. We understand the ramifications of this. We aren't stupid. We believe we will get a good group on that weekend and we will get plenty the weekend after.
It may change in the future -- but right now we want to test how this will impact the live events business. If it's a failure -- that's on me and I take full responsibility for that.
However, I think we are all missing the rationale -- you still have to beat 404 teams to win the NFFC and that HAS NOT CHANGED regardless of how many owners have multiple teams. [/QUOTE]FOR GOODNESS SAKES THAT IS THE 3RD TIME IN A POST YOU HAVE REFERRED TO IT AS THE NFFC. IT IS THE NFBC!
-
DiamondKing
- Posts: 401
- Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2005 6:00 pm
- Contact:
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Originally posted by DOUGHBOYS:
The years I have played in the NFBC, making friends, enjoying competition, and the comraderie, there has always been one constant- Greg will do the right thing.
I can't speak for everyone, just myself, and I know your company bought out the NFBC, Ryan, but you are making a horrific first impression.
Greg has built this event slowly over the years. He has asked for input every step of the way and most of the time he sides with what is right for the contest itself. The trust that he has garnered is the major componant for where the contest is today.
If Greg says two cities and multiple entries will help grow the NFBC, I would back him, because he has earned that trust.
Your posts on the other hand are on the verge of being pompous, arrogant, and elitist. I'm not one that usually throws those terms out there. So far you have had nine or ten posts. None of them reassure players that you want to build this contest slowly and correctly. If anything the opposite is true, it seems that you want to concentrate on "higher end products" such as an MVP party pass or $10,000 leagues.
Your chance for another first impression is gone.
Win us over. Tell us why we should put our trust in you, Ryan E Houston. We don't want promises of a VIP pass, we want to play fantasy baseball at a high level. It's your job to tell us why we should do it with Fanball.
I wish you luck. I know somebody who just lost the pass
The years I have played in the NFBC, making friends, enjoying competition, and the comraderie, there has always been one constant- Greg will do the right thing.
I can't speak for everyone, just myself, and I know your company bought out the NFBC, Ryan, but you are making a horrific first impression.
Greg has built this event slowly over the years. He has asked for input every step of the way and most of the time he sides with what is right for the contest itself. The trust that he has garnered is the major componant for where the contest is today.
If Greg says two cities and multiple entries will help grow the NFBC, I would back him, because he has earned that trust.
Your posts on the other hand are on the verge of being pompous, arrogant, and elitist. I'm not one that usually throws those terms out there. So far you have had nine or ten posts. None of them reassure players that you want to build this contest slowly and correctly. If anything the opposite is true, it seems that you want to concentrate on "higher end products" such as an MVP party pass or $10,000 leagues.
Your chance for another first impression is gone.
Win us over. Tell us why we should put our trust in you, Ryan E Houston. We don't want promises of a VIP pass, we want to play fantasy baseball at a high level. It's your job to tell us why we should do it with Fanball.
I wish you luck. I know somebody who just lost the pass
All pigs are created equal.Some are more equal than others.
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Originally posted by DOUGHBOYS:
Your posts on the other hand are on the verge of being pompous, arrogant, and elitist. I'm not one that usually throws those terms out there. Dough - You mean the " Ryan Houston's Exclusive VIP Party" pass was a bit much?
I gotta admit, I woulda thought it would say something like the "NFBC Exclusive VIP Party" pass. I can't imagine Greg ever naming it a "Greg Ambrosius's Exclusive VIP Party" pass
Your posts on the other hand are on the verge of being pompous, arrogant, and elitist. I'm not one that usually throws those terms out there. Dough - You mean the " Ryan Houston's Exclusive VIP Party" pass was a bit much?
I gotta admit, I woulda thought it would say something like the "NFBC Exclusive VIP Party" pass. I can't imagine Greg ever naming it a "Greg Ambrosius's Exclusive VIP Party" pass
-
Glenneration X
- Posts: 3730
- Joined: Sat Mar 21, 2009 6:00 pm
- Location: Long Island, NY
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Hello Greg, Ryan,
Huge news but honestly a lot for most of your loyal customers to absorb. I'm sure after the initial shock of these changes wears off, more specific recommendations that will help improve your event will start flowing in.
Some of my initial thoughts and observations....
I had already assumed that the NFBC was going multiple weekends based on a conversation I had with Ryan during the NFFC doubleheader. I had asked him what he thought about the WCOFB and though he wasn't specific, he indicated plans were being put in place for the NFBC to take on the upstart contest. Now I have no issues with a contest protecting its turf, in fact its good business..... I just think multiple weekends for the same Main Event is not the way to go. After speaking to Ryan, my thoughts headed towards a "new" Main Event with some different twists that would be created by the NFBC to challenge the WCOFB that weekend. My thinking was that the NFBC would create a "doubleheader" concept similar to what they do in football, with the one difference being that it would take place over consecutive weekends instead of the same day. I think this kind of idea would have gone over better with the rank and file of this contest.
Greg, KJ, I respect both of your opinions as you often add interesting and insightful posts to these threads. However, I have to disagree with both of you on a couple of your points here.
It is impossible to create a level playing field in a pooled contest between leagues drafting a week apart. True within the leagues themselves the playing field is level, however new information always changes the dynamic between seperate leagues. Nothing is more valuable to a fantasy player than information and therefore having more absolutely changes the playing field. Although there are advantages & disadvantages to drafting either early or late, the differing levels of information naturally creates differing starting points.
On another point for this topic, while its true that most of the focus once the season starts is to win your league, noone signs up initially for a Main Event to just win his league. We sign up for a chance at the overall... without that goal, it would be a bad investment to pay $1,300 for a chance at only $5,000 against 14 competitors.... we'd be better served to just play the satellites where we can lay down only a $1,000 with a chance to win $8,000. Therefore, the possibility for the overall prize has to be kept equal between all leagues to keep the investment in it equal, and a week is just too long of a gap to achieve that.
I'm not sure how I feel about multiple entries in the Main Event. I've yet to take a multiple entry in the online championships for either baseball or football, though they were relatively inexpensive. I did however take a 2nd Main Event team with the WCOFF due to the enormous discount they provided for multiple entries. Additional entries for the same event lowers the return on investment unless there is a discount incentive. Will one be provided for this contest? If so, will it be as substantial as that provided by WCOFF?
Regarding the Auction Championships..... great idea.
Regarding the Invitational......
great idea.
I was a new participant in the NFBC this past year. I enjoyed the experience tremendously and as stated many times think you all do a great job and have created a great contest with extremely loyal participants.
Greg, as I've told you many times, you've help turn me into a High Stakes junkie participating in numerous contests. However, even with my participation across the Fantasy landscape, I feel a sense of loyalty to this contest because of you, Tom, the way you run your contests, and my first year experiences here. You can count on me being an active participant in your contests for years to come.
That said, I just want to recommend that you be careful about what business model you follow. WCOFF became overambitious and with that came numerous issues that resulted in more complaints, a decreased personal feel, and worst of all, decreased loyalty in their constituency. I'd hate to see your contest have the same issues by following a similar path.
I know business is business, but keeping your event what made it great in the first place is good business.
With the highest regards,
Glenn
Huge news but honestly a lot for most of your loyal customers to absorb. I'm sure after the initial shock of these changes wears off, more specific recommendations that will help improve your event will start flowing in.
Some of my initial thoughts and observations....
I had already assumed that the NFBC was going multiple weekends based on a conversation I had with Ryan during the NFFC doubleheader. I had asked him what he thought about the WCOFB and though he wasn't specific, he indicated plans were being put in place for the NFBC to take on the upstart contest. Now I have no issues with a contest protecting its turf, in fact its good business..... I just think multiple weekends for the same Main Event is not the way to go. After speaking to Ryan, my thoughts headed towards a "new" Main Event with some different twists that would be created by the NFBC to challenge the WCOFB that weekend. My thinking was that the NFBC would create a "doubleheader" concept similar to what they do in football, with the one difference being that it would take place over consecutive weekends instead of the same day. I think this kind of idea would have gone over better with the rank and file of this contest.
Greg, KJ, I respect both of your opinions as you often add interesting and insightful posts to these threads. However, I have to disagree with both of you on a couple of your points here.
It is impossible to create a level playing field in a pooled contest between leagues drafting a week apart. True within the leagues themselves the playing field is level, however new information always changes the dynamic between seperate leagues. Nothing is more valuable to a fantasy player than information and therefore having more absolutely changes the playing field. Although there are advantages & disadvantages to drafting either early or late, the differing levels of information naturally creates differing starting points.
On another point for this topic, while its true that most of the focus once the season starts is to win your league, noone signs up initially for a Main Event to just win his league. We sign up for a chance at the overall... without that goal, it would be a bad investment to pay $1,300 for a chance at only $5,000 against 14 competitors.... we'd be better served to just play the satellites where we can lay down only a $1,000 with a chance to win $8,000. Therefore, the possibility for the overall prize has to be kept equal between all leagues to keep the investment in it equal, and a week is just too long of a gap to achieve that.
I'm not sure how I feel about multiple entries in the Main Event. I've yet to take a multiple entry in the online championships for either baseball or football, though they were relatively inexpensive. I did however take a 2nd Main Event team with the WCOFF due to the enormous discount they provided for multiple entries. Additional entries for the same event lowers the return on investment unless there is a discount incentive. Will one be provided for this contest? If so, will it be as substantial as that provided by WCOFF?
Regarding the Auction Championships..... great idea.
Regarding the Invitational......
great idea.
I was a new participant in the NFBC this past year. I enjoyed the experience tremendously and as stated many times think you all do a great job and have created a great contest with extremely loyal participants.
Greg, as I've told you many times, you've help turn me into a High Stakes junkie participating in numerous contests. However, even with my participation across the Fantasy landscape, I feel a sense of loyalty to this contest because of you, Tom, the way you run your contests, and my first year experiences here. You can count on me being an active participant in your contests for years to come.
That said, I just want to recommend that you be careful about what business model you follow. WCOFF became overambitious and with that came numerous issues that resulted in more complaints, a decreased personal feel, and worst of all, decreased loyalty in their constituency. I'd hate to see your contest have the same issues by following a similar path.
I know business is business, but keeping your event what made it great in the first place is good business.
With the highest regards,
Glenn
-
Chest Rockwell
- Posts: 2400
- Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 6:00 pm
- Contact:
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Originally posted by sportsbettingman:
If you edited out just one condescending remark from each of your posts, Ryan...you'd be way better off.
You need a post editor! I never agree with Lance on anything except this. I am really getting off to a slow start here. I find the posts to be patronizing and condescending. A lot of us run a business a heck of a lot bigger than fanball/nfbc. We understand why we do things and they are always in our minds the good thing for the business. We often have customers who do not believe it. I just had 40 customers in for a jags/Cardinals game and probably got asked the same question 7 times in 2 hours. You have to be careful how you answer. Most importantly if your customers are giving you feedback do not write things that subtly try to quiet the conversation.
I think the party pass is great. I am sure about 20-25 % of your customers will love it and it is worth doing in that case. The timing of the announcement was awful and a lot of people thought it. Also it screamed of look at me- should it not be an NFBC party not named after yourself? It also by the notion of what can you do to earn this, naming it VIP, and at the bottom saying only certain people will be allowed in was poor taste to me. Everyone at a live event is spending enough discretionary income to be treated well. I would beg you to not respond why you did it that way (I am sure you had a good reason) but to see how it might have isolated a ton of your customers.
Understand this though a lot of us get that kind of treatment all year long and you simply will not throw a party that will impress us. What does impress me is providing an environment where I can catch up with old friends and talk about our families, our passions, baseball for a couple of days. For me it is a welcome break because people are so real, nice, genuine, and focused on the things in life that are important. I freaking love that.
Alright I have that off of my "chest".
One other thought- I appreciate the passion of everyone and I am shocked at how a lot of guys who really do not complain about anything are complaining. Something tells me this would be a lot more easy on Greg if it were Gekko, Walla, and KJ Duke offering ideas here.
Lastly Greg has been a good friend to all of us. He has told you he takes this stuff personally. We should show him the ultimate level of respect and most importantly when in doubt give the man the benefit of the doubt.
Now I am ready to move on and spend a ton of money this year. This auction thing has me pumped.
If you edited out just one condescending remark from each of your posts, Ryan...you'd be way better off.
You need a post editor!
I never agree with Lance on anything except this. I am really getting off to a slow start here. I find the posts to be patronizing and condescending. A lot of us run a business a heck of a lot bigger than fanball/nfbc. We understand why we do things and they are always in our minds the good thing for the business. We often have customers who do not believe it. I just had 40 customers in for a jags/Cardinals game and probably got asked the same question 7 times in 2 hours. You have to be careful how you answer. Most importantly if your customers are giving you feedback do not write things that subtly try to quiet the conversation.I think the party pass is great. I am sure about 20-25 % of your customers will love it and it is worth doing in that case. The timing of the announcement was awful and a lot of people thought it. Also it screamed of look at me- should it not be an NFBC party not named after yourself? It also by the notion of what can you do to earn this, naming it VIP, and at the bottom saying only certain people will be allowed in was poor taste to me. Everyone at a live event is spending enough discretionary income to be treated well. I would beg you to not respond why you did it that way (I am sure you had a good reason) but to see how it might have isolated a ton of your customers.
Understand this though a lot of us get that kind of treatment all year long and you simply will not throw a party that will impress us. What does impress me is providing an environment where I can catch up with old friends and talk about our families, our passions, baseball for a couple of days. For me it is a welcome break because people are so real, nice, genuine, and focused on the things in life that are important. I freaking love that.
Alright I have that off of my "chest".
One other thought- I appreciate the passion of everyone and I am shocked at how a lot of guys who really do not complain about anything are complaining. Something tells me this would be a lot more easy on Greg if it were Gekko, Walla, and KJ Duke offering ideas here.
Lastly Greg has been a good friend to all of us. He has told you he takes this stuff personally. We should show him the ultimate level of respect and most importantly when in doubt give the man the benefit of the doubt.
Now I am ready to move on and spend a ton of money this year. This auction thing has me pumped.
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Kind of a side question after reading these posts.
Random league assignments are a key to league/event integrity. With the use of syndicates, how can random assignment go in concert with the same person not having control over two teams in the same league?
Random league assignments are a key to league/event integrity. With the use of syndicates, how can random assignment go in concert with the same person not having control over two teams in the same league?
-
Chest Rockwell
- Posts: 2400
- Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 6:00 pm
- Contact:
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Originally posted by Gekko:
quote:Originally posted by DOUGHBOYS:
Your posts on the other hand are on the verge of being pompous, arrogant, and elitist. I'm not one that usually throws those terms out there. Dough - You mean the " Ryan Houston's Exclusive VIP Party" pass was a bit much?
I gotta admit, I woulda thought it would say something like the "NFBC Exclusive VIP Party" pass. I can't imagine Greg ever naming it a "Greg Ambrosius's Exclusive VIP Party" pass [/QUOTE]Mark you nailed it on the head there. I wanted to throw up.
quote:Originally posted by DOUGHBOYS:
Your posts on the other hand are on the verge of being pompous, arrogant, and elitist. I'm not one that usually throws those terms out there. Dough - You mean the " Ryan Houston's Exclusive VIP Party" pass was a bit much?
I gotta admit, I woulda thought it would say something like the "NFBC Exclusive VIP Party" pass. I can't imagine Greg ever naming it a "Greg Ambrosius's Exclusive VIP Party" pass [/QUOTE]Mark you nailed it on the head there. I wanted to throw up.
-
CC's Desperados
- Posts: 2558
- Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2004 6:00 pm
2010 NFBC Draft Dates and Locations Revealed
Originally posted by Chest Rockwell:
quote:Originally posted by Gekko:
quote:Originally posted by DOUGHBOYS:
Your posts on the other hand are on the verge of being pompous, arrogant, and elitist. I'm not one that usually throws those terms out there. Dough - You mean the " Ryan Houston's Exclusive VIP Party" pass was a bit much?
I gotta admit, I woulda thought it would say something like the "NFBC Exclusive VIP Party" pass. I can't imagine Greg ever naming it a "Greg Ambrosius's Exclusive VIP Party" pass [/QUOTE]Mark you nailed it on the head there. I wanted to throw up. [/QUOTE]I was under the impression that everyone would have their name on their pass. Maybe I read it wrong. I thought he was showing his pass and what it would look like.
quote:Originally posted by Gekko:
quote:Originally posted by DOUGHBOYS:
Your posts on the other hand are on the verge of being pompous, arrogant, and elitist. I'm not one that usually throws those terms out there. Dough - You mean the " Ryan Houston's Exclusive VIP Party" pass was a bit much?
I gotta admit, I woulda thought it would say something like the "NFBC Exclusive VIP Party" pass. I can't imagine Greg ever naming it a "Greg Ambrosius's Exclusive VIP Party" pass [/QUOTE]Mark you nailed it on the head there. I wanted to throw up. [/QUOTE]I was under the impression that everyone would have their name on their pass. Maybe I read it wrong. I thought he was showing his pass and what it would look like.