Suspened Game Stats

[Cocktails and Dreams]

So if I were to use Casilla and he were to pitch today in that game I wouldn't get the stats? That is not right, nor should I get further hitting stats from my batters unless they are in my lineup. The stats from that period SHOULD already be in the standings as what is done is done. And what happens now in the game SHOULD be included on what you set for now. This action is happening now. This seems ridiculous. And since they are operating in this manner we have to manually figure out the impact of the KC game throughout the season. Bottom line it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever to get stats for games now if you don't have that guy in your lineup now. And it makes no sense to not get stats now for a guy you have in there now. The stats are happening now.

Chad: I agree that it would have been better if the stats were split and already counted, but that ship has sailed. I've been operating under the assumption that I did not need to keep players on my team to get the stats for that game.

Obviously you should get stats for that game and will. But there is no way you should get further stats in the game if they are not in your lineup now IMO. Having Romo in a league back then but no longer, there is no way in hell I should get a save if he were to save the game today, and the current owner that may have him in there, not get one. He didn't save a game then. He saves it now. I have never heard of such a thing, and nowhere have I heard that is even how it works. So I am operating under the assumption that stats earned then will be included. That is obvious and most certainly is the case. Even though they should be already included, it is what it is. They are coming. But what we have not been told is how the remainder of the game works. And there is only one acceptable answer IMO. The Romo situation I pointed out is the best example of why.

[Hells Satans]

Agree with you. Another example....I had Cuddyer in my lineup. He's now DLd. My guess is Dickerson will pinch run for him when the game restarts, as Cuddyer is on 1B. I didn't have Dickerson in my lineup on May 22, but he was on my team and he's in my lineup this week. Do I not get Dickerson's stats for today?

[Cocktails and Dreams]

You should get Dickerson stats for remainder of game, as you deserve them since the stats are being accumulated in this period. But I am not sure if you will. If you don't then that means a team with Romo in there back that could potentially get a save today in the game even if they don't have him anymore. That would be absurd. I hope we don't hear some BS about the programming is not set up to handle a split game situation so we have to do it that way. That would not be acceptable IMO.

[Money]

Agree with you. Another example....I had Cuddyer in my lineup. He's now DLd. My guess is Dickerson will pinch run for him when the game restarts, as Cuddyer is on 1B. I didn't have Dickerson in my lineup on May 22, but he was on my team and he's in my lineup this week. Do I not get Dickerson's stats for today?

I think the NFBC will handle it just as MLB handles it. Any player on the current roster is eligible to play and score in this game. Those players not on the rosters (anymore) are no longer eligible to score in the this game. The stats from the beginning of the game are those stats. Today's stats and rosters are to be used for the resumption of the game.

This seems pretty clear cut to me. The NFBC follows MLB statistically and I'm sure that this will be no different.

[Greg Ambrosius]

I will definitely get the correct explanation before I speculate on this. I'm pretty sure I know how we do this -- and these definitely aren't the first MLB suspended games -- but let me get it correct before I post here, okay? I definitely don't want to mis-speak here and add confusion to these suspended games.

I hate suspended games. They just muck up the real-time standings.

[Money]

I will definitely get the correct explanation before I speculate on this. I'm pretty sure I know how we do this -- and these definitely aren't the first MLB suspended games -- but let me get it correct before I post here, okay? I definitely don't want to mis-speak here and add confusion to these suspended games.

I hate suspended games. They just muck up the real-time standings.

This is a not an IT call. It matters not how the software is set up, it only matters that the NFBC do as they have always done and follow MLB. If the software is not set up properly then manual adjustments will have to take place tomorrow. A tech guy should not be deciding the rules here.

[Greg Ambrosius]

It's the same way we've always handled suspended games that get made up in a later period. From IT:

All teams that had players in this suspended game going last week WILL receive these stats once this game is completed. The system knows which teams had active players that day, but the stats aren't loaded until the game is complete. But you will get those stats when the game is completed in September. Hopefully this helps explain how the Suspended Game is being handled; any player who was on your roster when this game started will have stats through five innings loaded when the game is completed in September.

[Money]

It's the same way we've always handled suspended games that get made up in a later period. From IT:

All teams that had players in this suspended game going last week WILL receive these stats once this game is completed. The system knows which teams had active players that day, but the stats aren't loaded until the game is complete. But you will get those stats when the game is completed in September. Hopefully this helps explain how the Suspended Game is being handled; any player who was on your roster when this game started will have stats through five innings loaded when the game is completed in September.

Greg, those are not the stats in question. The stats going forward are and should count from the current lineups, correct?

[Cocktails and Dreams]

We already all know that Greg. That is clear. The question remains what happens to the rest of the game. If I have Romo back then. I drop him. Someone else picks him up and has him in now. Surely he gets the stats for todays game and not me. With roster lock approaching I am basing the decision that common sense will prevail on stats accrued rest of game since I still don't have an answer. We know that those stats are coming for the Pence homer and all ofther stats for that game that already happened. That is not the question here.

[Money]

I hope I understand this correctly. Today's rosters count toward stats accumulated today. Last months rosters receive all stats that were accumulated last month.

[Greg Ambrosius]

This game picks up tomorrow. Explain to me how this will work. As of now, my understanding is that none of the stats from that game are included in our totals. Will all of the stats from the completed game (from players who were in our lineups in May) be included in our stats regardless of whether the players are still in our lineup this week? Or even if they are still on our team? What if they are now on another NFBC team?

Correct. MLB treats the continuation of these games statistically as having happened on the days they were begun and so does the NFBC. Everyone who had any player in their starting lineup back on May 22nd accumulates stats for those players today and all stats from that game will run tonight.

Much has changed since then, but blame MLB for making these two teams finish this game three months later. It's fair to those owners who had these players in their starting lineups back in May to get complete stats from this game, even if it is being finished on Sept. 1st. According to all MLB records, this is the May 22nd game.

[Hells Satans]

I actually assumed that is how MLB would treat it. If that's the case, then I can't really argue with the result here.

[Money]

This game picks up tomorrow. Explain to me how this will work. As of now, my understanding is that none of the stats from that game are included in our totals. Will all of the stats from the completed game (from players who were in our lineups in May) be included in our stats regardless of whether the players are still in our lineup this week? Or even if they are still on our team? What if they are now on another NFBC team?

Correct. MLB treats the continuation of these games statistically as having happened on the days they were begun and so does the NFBC. Everyone who had any player in their starting lineup back on May 22nd accumulates stats for those players today and all stats from that game will run tonight.

Much has changed since then, but blame MLB for making these two teams finish this game three months later. It's fair to those owners who had these players in their starting lineups back in May to get complete stats from this game, even if it is being finished on Sept. 1st. According to all MLB records, this is the May 22nd game.

Rosters have changed in the NFBC and MLB. Current MLB rosters are used for today game, that is not the case in the NFBC. Fair? what is fair when it comes to this game. It's simply the breaks of the game and those that receive stats from todays game from those that are not on their rosters today have caught a big break.

We'll never agree on this, so I'll let it go. It's just not as black and white as you make it out ot be. I could go on and on showing precedence and the parallels to MLB but I won't as it will do no good.

It is what it is, but should probably be re-visited in the off season and added to the rules.

[Cocktails and Dreams]

MLB treats it as though roster changes are allowed to participate in the game. Unfortunately, that is not how the NFBC looks at it. Our roster changes are not allowed to participate in the game. In fact the opposite happens. I don't agree with it at all. Never will I be able to understand how it makes any sense for a Romo owner from days of the past to get a save this scoring period when he did not have him during the scoring period such save takes place. And current owner just watches him save a game and watches another team gain on him in the standings. Fun stuff.

[DOUGHBOYS]

This is a tough situation for the game operator. In the past, I thought they were handling it the correct way. But, times have changed and so has Major League Baseball. Stability of players and teams were more concrete in the past.
Not so now.
And our game has changed as well.

Let's take Sergio Romo, since his name has been mentioned.
When inserted into the May lineup, his owners had a reasonable expectation that he could get a Save from the game. If that owner still has Romo or he has gone to another team, their owners do not have the same expectation. They may not want Romo's stats in September, but are force-fed his stats.
Three months later, Romo is not in the same situation. It has become unfair for the May owner to be handcuffed to Romo three months later for a lineup that was designated for May.

The fair thing to do for suspended games is to only have the stats that are provided for the played part of the game count towards that teams fantasy stats. The stats provided three months later will be at the whim of the owner of those players three months later. In this way, a lineup that was meant for May statistics still get May stats and the continuation of the game in September will be in the September lineups.

[Money]

This is a tough situation for the game operator. In the past, I thought they were handling it the correct way. But, times have changed and so has Major League Baseball. Stability of players and teams were more concrete in the past.
Not so now.
And our game has changed as well.

Let's take Sergio Romo, since his name has been mentioned.
When inserted into the May lineup, his owners had a reasonable expectation that he could get a Save from the game. If that owner still has Romo or he has gone to another team, their owners do not have the same expectation. They may not want Romo's stats in September, but are force-fed his stats.
Three months later, Romo is not in the same situation. It has become unfair for the May owner to be handcuffed to Romo three months later for a lineup that was designated for May.

The fair thing to do for suspended games is to only have the stats that are provided for the played part of the game count towards that teams fantasy stats. The stats provided three months later will be at the whim of the owner of those players three months later. In this way, a lineup that was meant for May statistics still get May stats and the continuation of the game in September will be in the September lineups.

Obviously I agree with you Dan. To compound it further imagine the dismay as you watch Romo or Casilla pitch in the first game possibly eliminating them from two games (depending on workload) to follow in the next day. All this while having to set your lineup for this playing period without knowing the results of that game.

You are correct also in that this is a tough situation for the game operator. Fair today and this week does not = Romo and Casilla owners who did not have them originally. As with everything in this game, you deal with it and move on.

Thanks for the comments.

[JohnP]

What if the situation was:

Hudson and De La Rosa each with a no-hitter 12k outing through 8. De La Rosa gets two more ks with a clean 9th. Hudson loads up the bags with Rockies in the bottom of the 9th. Game gets suspended and resumed in Sept.

Upon resuming - reliever comes in gives up a grand slam to Tulo (now you know this is fictional, Tulo doesn't play in Sept).

If we try to do the split stat thing.....

Which De La Rosa owner gets the win - May or Sept?

Which Hudson owners get charged for the earned runs - May or Sept? He put the runners on in May. They scored in Sept.

What about the runners on base? Blackmon was one of the guys that walked in the 9th. His getting on base activity happened in May. He scored in Sept. Which owner gets the run?

[DOUGHBOYS]

The owner in May would know the situation. It puts it squarely on his shoulders as to what to do with these players.
As is now, he has no choice.

As for what happens with the runners, what happens in May, should happen in May. That owner would be charged with no runs.
If those runs come in, in September, the current owner had a strong opinion that those runs would not score against his pitcher, and would be penalized for having starting the pitcher.

[TParsons]

So if the stats from the suspended game count toward the prior period, why are the lineups for these teams locked for this period? Do the rules not state that you should be able to move these players until 5 min prior to the start of the game for the period?

[Money]

So if the stats from the suspended game count toward the prior period, why are the lineups for these teams locked for this period? Do the rules not state that you should be able to move these players until 5 min prior to the start of the game for the period?

This is an excellent point. The locks are supposed to occur 5 minutes prior to the current scoring period. The decision to play anyone in the first game of the scoring period (under current interpretation) should not be until 5 minutes before the game scheduled for Sepember 1st.

[Greg Ambrosius]

So if the stats from the suspended game count toward the prior period, why are the lineups for these teams locked for this period? Do the rules not state that you should be able to move these players until 5 min prior to the start of the game for the period?

This is an excellent point. The locks are supposed to occur 5 minutes prior to the current scoring period. The decision to play anyone in the first game of the scoring period (under current interpretation) should not be until 5 minutes before the game scheduled for Sepember 1st.

Guys, the player locks are 5 minutes before their scheduled start time. The reason the players locked from the COL-SF game is because the start time of the regularly scheduled, 9-inning game that counts for today was 4:10pm ET. They just happened to start the suspended game first at the same time. The scheduled start time of the game that counts today was still 4:10pm ET.

[JohnP]

So.....the stats are now included in our totals? How do we know? Are they showing up in the May period? I don't see them in the current period. Overall standings now include all games played except for the other suspended game?

[Cocktails and Dreams]

I think that is correct John, although it is a pain in the ass to figure out. I checked a team with Pence and he was credited with full game stats, although Pence owners would have been playing him either way. I also checked Romo stats, and former Romo owners were undeservedly credited with his good outing.

The explanation remains absurd. Obviously, MLB has to list the stats somewhere. They aren't going to list two different boxscores. That has nothing to do with fantasy baseball though. In fantasy baseball you should get the stats for what the players do during the time frame they do it if they are in your lineup. This is extremely bothersome that simple common sense is not used. To just say it is fair because MLB lists the game as the 22nd of May is asinine. MLB allows new rosters to participate and decide the conclusion. Yet NFBC doesn't, and simply says it is listed as May 22nd game. Completely ridiculous.

And it also is even more bothersome this isn't listed in the rules, especially when the path of common sense not being used is taken. Lets see, who is deserving of the Casilla save YESTERDAY. A may 22 owner or the guy that has him when he saves the game. Why would I assume I wouldn't be justified to the save owning him now, based on the rules?

[Money]

I think that is correct John, although it is a pain in the ass to figure out. I checked a team with Pence and he was credited with full game stats, although Pence owners would have been playing him either way. I also checked Romo stats, and former Romo owners were undeservedly credited with his good outing.

The explanation remains absurd. Obviously, MLB has to list the stats somewhere. They aren't going to list two different boxscores. That has nothing to do with fantasy baseball though. In fantasy baseball you should get the stats for what the players do during the time frame they do it if they are in your lineup. This is extremely bothersome that simple common sense is not used. To just say it is fair because MLB lists the game as the 22nd of May is asinine.

In reality Chad I think they are just figuring this stuff out as they go. IT plays a roll which make no sense either. A few years back we had an additional play in game added to the regular season which MLB considers a regular season game, so the NFBC stated we follow MLB and these stats will count as well. They did it perfectly letting everyone know in advance. They then decided that it would be part of the previous scoring period even though it was being played on a Monday, that's their prerogative but was probably driven by an IT issue.

So now we get hit with this situation. MLB uses the current roster and the NFBC, who has stated in the past that they follow MLB always uses the May rosters. The word fair was used and this is anything but. The communication that was there for the extra games was not here for this situation and that's unfortunate. Had it been thought through properly I think they would have done the right thing instead of the easy thing.

[DOUGHBOYS]

It sounds strange, but fantasy players are not concerned about games. We only care about the stats within the game.
When we make a lineup for May, our starting lineup is for the stats received in May. We don't have an inkling, nor should we, that those lineups and stats would/could pertain to a game in September. We shouldn't have to care about a game in September....until September.
Tim Lincecum started games in May and was probably in most May lineups. Now in September, he is a reliever.
It's silly to think that a Lincecum owner in May would be rewarded for a September 'W' or Save , if that had happened.

I would think it would be an easy IT fix to provide the stats formed in May to May lineups and the stats for the continuation of the game to the September lineups. The September lineups would, of course, have the winning pitcher and Save, if there is one.
As is now, it provides confusion and frustration.