All Time Baseball Draft

Asumijet · Post by **Asumijet** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 3:47 am

Putting some additional thought into the issue, I brainstormed a few ideas:

1) For the entire draft, we pick the player, but not indicate the year of stats being utilized. At the end of the draft we have 24 hours to submit the years/positions being used. Then stats are calculated. Or maybe we start this after a certain round. Clearly, we can make a strong educated guess as to which year the drafters are using, but the lack of certainty should add enough unpredictability to help prevent any perceived problems.

2) For all picks, make the selection and commit to the year of stats, but only Dan knows the year.

3) After Round 20; we KDS picks based on current standings. Leader picks which pick for that round you want. Then do it again for Round 22 and 23. As the leader, I can choose between selecting the best player or last choice in order to control the final selection.

Navel Lint · Post by **Navel Lint** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 4:09 am

If Dan is willing, I would suggest this.

Three random rounds during the draft (3,4,5 or 4,8,14 or whatever) we submit our picks to Dan. Now your pick for that round may have already been taken and you might have to pick again which will slow those rounds down some, but it wouldn’t be too bad.

Then after each of the “blind” rounds Dan can post the 15 different players taken off the board in alphabetical order and we continue drafting as normal until the next “blind’ round. After the 23rd round Dan can reveal who each owner has taken. (Plus it would add suspense to the final reveal at the end

)

I suggest doing three rounds of this because it would be much harder with 3 open roster spots per owner to narrow down which position each owner filled and therefore which player they may have choosen.

[ October 15, 2011, 10:13 AM: Message edited by: Navel Lint ]

CC's Desperados · Post by **CC's Desperados** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 4:21 am

Here's the signup list:

1-Shawn Childs

2-Rick Thomas

3-Todd Zola (Spreadsheet)

4-Dave Shovein

5-Mark (Mbendar16)

6-Russel (Naval Lint)

7-Steve Wells

8-Kelly (Suburban Strugglers)

9-Neal Moses

10-Texas Connection

11-Brian Slack (GLG20)

12-Mark Sebro

13-The King of the Hill

14-John Pausma

15-

CC's Desperados · Post by **CC's Desperados** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 4:23 am

Originally posted by Gekko:

quote:Originally posted by CC's Desperados:

1-I think the player should only qualify in the year he played a position as we have the results. So if A-Rod only played 3RD during the year, he should qualify at that position only.

Shawn - if a player played 20+ at 2 different positions in the same year, is he eligible at either position? [/QUOTE]It should be the same as any other draft. You can move a player around if you have to, but you are still locked into the year you pick.

CC's Desperados · Post by **CC's Desperados** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 4:25 am

Originally posted by :

To add on to Gekko's question- If we select a multiple-position eligible player, do we need to "declare" which position he will fill when we draft him, or can he be moved as the draft proceeds? Will somebody be checking position eligibility as we draft? What happens if we goof? Like drafting Roger Bresnahan 1903 at catcher? Sorry about all the rookie questions... but hell, I'm a rookie! We are all rookies in this. I think I answered your question in the Gekko respone.

CC's Desperados · Post by **CC's Desperados** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 4:26 am

Originally posted by :

We declare which year's stats we want to use when we draft a player, and can't change to a different year for that player later on, correct? Once you pick the year and the round, you are locked in.

CC's Desperados · Post by **CC's Desperados** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 4:28 am

Originally posted by Texas Connection:

I keep wondering if the guy with the last pick of the last round could be out of the running but could make his pick and determine who he wants to win it. I guess it could be a $1400 decision. Jon Stadtmueller I think this is a legit possibility.

CC's Desperados · Post by **CC's Desperados** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 4:32 am

Originally posted by Navel Lint:

quote:Originally posted by Texas Connection:

I keep wondering if the guy with the last pick of the last round could be out of the running but could make his pick and determine who he wants to win it. I guess it could be a $1400 decision. Jon Stadtmueller I’ve considered the same thing. I wouldn’t want to use the word “collusion”, I think that would be somewhat insulting in this group, but clearly when we get toward the end game, one or two owners could steer the final results in one direction or another.

I know part of the exercise of doing this league is to post players on the message board and to talk about the great seasons they had, to learn some of the history of the game.

I am planning to make a short write up about each player I take, whether it is about the stats themselves or the historical context during which they were earned. I would do that because the history of the game is just something that I’m into and would love to share some of it with other baseball fans.

That being said, I think that at some point we should just announce on the MB the player we are taking, but not the year. This means we would have to send our actual Player with Year Pick to a neutral party. I haven’t talked to anyone about this, but I would be happy to make a suggestion since he is not playing........ Dan (DOUGHBOYS)....Sorry to put you on the spot like that

(I’d be happy to add another $5? per team to cover his time).

The question is, what would be the proper number of picks to “hide”? I don’t know.

Should it be the last five? Maybe the middle 10? Or maybe the first five, when great players like Ruth have several seasons to choose from. Or hide no player years? [/QUOTE]I think you made a very good suggestion. How about we send the neutral picks for rounds 5, 10, 15, and 20. We then can have the nuetral party reveal them on the message after we complete the draft. I'm open to any other option.

Nevadaman · Post by **Nevadaman** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 4:41 am

Some of these suggestions are getting crazy and requiring Dan to do too much work. It makes no sense to have any blind rounds in the middle of the draft because we will still know the overall totals for each team which is the relevant part. (KJ said he would be posting totals after each round) Now, if we cannot follow the totals all the way through, that will take the fun out of it IMO. The last round or two is what's relevant as far as any possible collusion, etc. OR, we could just consider the KDS as part of the strategy and let the chips fall where they may.

[ October 15, 2011, 10:43 AM: Message edited by: Nevadaman ]

CC's Desperados · Post by **CC's Desperados** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 4:42 am

Originally posted by Nevadaman:

Forgot to add that I'm in favor of keeping the 1500 innings because these historical seasons have many starters going 300+ and even some 400+. We should avoid gimmick strategies. As it is, one will be able to have 0-4 relievers and that's more in line with the spirit of the game and reality. Originally I thought 1500 was no problem when we were using 1876 as the staring date. Neal made a good point. I thought maybe a team might have to 6 starter and three relievers to compete in save if they don't get the right combination.

I'm ok with 1500 as you made a point later about the high innings totals by starters in earlier years. We can do whatever the group wants to do. We could also add two reliever slots to make sure all team don't punts saves. This may be tough because it will be very easy to draft a reliever who doesn't get saves. I'll let the group add some input on what they want to do in this area.

DOUGHBOYS · Post by **DOUGHBOYS** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 4:43 am

Don't worry about me.

I'd enjoy it.

Use me however you guys see fit.

Nevadaman · Post by **Nevadaman** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 4:47 am

I'm fine with two reliever slots. 1500 innings will be a cinch to reach. Even if 6 starters averaged only 225 innings (and I suspect it will be much higher), you would be at 1350 with 3 pitchers left to select, so I don't see a problem.

[ October 15, 2011, 10:53 AM: Message edited by: Nevadaman ]

CC's Desperados · Post by **CC's Desperados** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 4:48 am

Originally posted by Asumijet:

quote:Originally posted by CC's Desperados:

quote:Originally posted by Asumijet:

Shawn-

A few questions for you-

1) Is the position eligibility based on the year they gained the stats or is it the year prior. For example, the first year ARod became a Yankee and player 3B, he was eligible for fantasy purposes for SS and gained 3B eligibility. Thus 3B and SS eligible for our purposes or just 3B eligible for that year?

2) Do we have a standard stats source that everyone has access to? Would hate for there to be an error in a stat source. I have been using mlb.com.

3) Since we are not using the pre-1900 players and the high pitching innings from that error, any consideration for decreasing the inning requirement total?

4) KDS?

Thanks. 1-I think the player should only qualify in the year he played a position as we have the results. So if A-Rod only played 3RD during the year, he should qualify at that position only.

2- I suggest we use Baseball-Reference.com for our stats. It is the easiest site to get all the stats we need.

3-How about 1300? A team can go 6 or 7 starters and still make the innings.

4-sure [/QUOTE]Do we need a subscription to use the site? Or am I looking in the wrong place? [/QUOTE]It looks like they added a subscription feature, but he can get around it by sorting leaders in runs, RBI, or whatever. It will give you a list of player's names. You then can click on any player you what in the list. It will probably be easier to use once we start using it and I'm sure some players will be better at it than others.

ToddZ · Post by **ToddZ** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:04 am

Well, I was going to keep this my little secret, but you can pull multiple years of stats at a time for free from www.fangraphs.com.

That said, you guys are on your own with the Excel manipulation

Navel Lint · Post by **Navel Lint** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:09 am

Originally posted by Nevadaman:

Some of these suggestions are getting crazy and requiring Dan to do too much work. It makes no sense to have any blind rounds in the middle of the draft because we will still know the overall totals for each team which is the relevant part. (KJ said he would be posting totals after each round) Now, if we cannot follow the totals all the way through, that will take the fun out of it IMO. The last round or two is what's relevant as far as any possible collusion, etc. OR, we could just consider the KDS as part of the strategy and let the chips fall where they may. Actually, you won't know the full totals, and thats the point. During the 3/4 blind rounds, you will know what 15 players have been taken off the board at the completion of the round, but you won't know what team they belong to. After 23 rounds, all 15 owners will have 3/4 blank spots on their roster. those spots will then be revealed by Dan

As for letting the chips fall where they may….. well, it is $100 to get in and $1400 for the winner. The truth is, I don’t know you guys. I know some of you have personal relationships, and let’s be honest , that “could” influence your final pick. Or someone might not want “X” person or “GG” person to win. Just kidding GEKKO

Let me be clear though. I am not making any accusations . I’m just saying let’s take the temptation away.

Nevadaman · Post by **Nevadaman** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:16 am

Russell, I understand what you're saying now, but I hate the idea of not seeing the standings for the last half of the draft. If the 3/4 blind rounds came at the very end, it would be MUCH better for the game.

ToddZ · Post by **ToddZ** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:17 am

I'm going to go with majority on the blind pick issue, but I do think we should keep in mind that this entire draft is going to be public and I am pretty sure we each value our reputations more than obviously influencing the outcome of the draft.

Gekko · Post by **Gekko** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:19 am

Originally posted by ToddZ:

I'm going to go with majority on the blind pick issue, but I do think we should keep in mind that this entire draft is going to be public and I am pretty sure we each value our reputations more than obviously influencing the outcome of the draft. why not up the entry fee to $125 or $150 and pay out 2nd place?

Gekko · Post by **Gekko** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:20 am

Originally posted by Navel Lint:

Or someone might not want “X” person or “GG” person to win. Just kidding GEKKO

Navel Lint · Post by **Navel Lint** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:35 am

Originally posted by Nevadaman:

Russell, I understand what you're saying now, but I hate the idea of not seeing the standings for the last half of the draft. If the 3/4 blind rounds came at the very end, it would be MUCH better for the game. You will still see the standings after each of the 23 rounds. It's just that after each of the "blind" rounds, the numbers won't change from the previous round.

After the 23rd round. Each owner would have full stats for 20 players and then we add in the 3/4 "blind" rounds

Navel Lint · Post by **Navel Lint** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:38 am

Originally posted by Gekko:

quote:Originally posted by Navel Lint:

Or someone might not want “X” person or “GG” person to win. Just kidding GEKKO

[/QUOTE]I hope you know that I really was just joking

. I could have picked any of the names on the list.

Gekko · Post by **Gekko** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:44 am

Originally posted by Navel Lint:

quote:Originally posted by Gekko:

quote:Originally posted by Navel Lint:

Or someone might not want “X” person or “GG” person to win. Just kidding GEKKO

[/QUOTE]I hope you know that I really was just joking

. I could have picked any of the names on the list.

[/QUOTE]

Suburban Strugglers · Post by **Suburban Strugglers** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 6:04 am

What ever you guys decide in terms of blind rounds I am good with, I do think we do have to lower the innings from the 1500 but it seems like everyone agrees on that anyways

CC's Desperados · Post by **CC's Desperados** » Sat Oct 15, 2011 6:19 am

Here's the signup list:

1-Shawn Childs

2-

3-Todd Zola (Spreadsheet)

4-Dave Shovein

5-Mark (Mbendar16)

6-Russel (Naval Lint)

7-Steve Wells

8-Kelly (Suburban Strugglers)

9-Neal Moses

10-Texas Connection

11-Brian Slack (GLG20)

12-Mark Sebro

13-The King of the Hill

14-John Pausma

15-Glenn Lowy

Rick thought it was too much while he was on the road. We have one spot left.

[ October 15, 2011, 12:30 PM: Message edited by: CC's Desperados ]