Nevada bans DFS

[TOXIC ASSETS]

Like Gekko I'm also a PA guy and we can hang our hopes on one thing here:

The governor could always VETO the legislation that has been proposed.

[BK METS]

here is the link to the bill. does anyone see anything separating daily from season long???

http://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/leg ... 97&pn=1572

Based upon the news story Greg posted, it specifically stated the original bill was going to be "amended to specifically address daily fantasy sports". See below:

State Representative George Dunbar (R – Westmoreland County) is amending a previous version of House Bill 1197, to specifically address daily fantasy sports. On Monday, Dunbar met with lobbyists representing the widely popular fantasy websites that allow players to wager money on single-day fantasy sports. Dunbar says the industry believes their “skill-based” form of gaming shouldn’t require regulation. He disagrees, saying without regulation on a state level, daily fantasy sites could likely suffer the same fate as online poker, which is now illegal.

So, to me, they are separating the two. No?

[Gekko]

So, to me, they are separating the two. No?

believing a politician is one of the last things on my "to trust" list. let's see what the actual legislation says once it's amended

[Gekko]

Like Gekko I'm also a PA guy and we can hang our hopes on one thing here:

The governor could always VETO the legislation that has been proposed.

in my book, there is a 100% probability that DFS companies are going to be put through the financial grinder by most, if not all states, before it is said and done. my main concern is season-long fantasy sports

[Gekko]

Of course all fantasy is lumped together. There is no separation in the eyes of those who do not participate.
Most of the country has no idea that there are even different types of fantasy play.
We are at the mercy of public opinion and knee jerk reactions from politicians in different states.

with respect, what is different between daily and annual? it's gambling. the govt wants a cut. no shit. you guys are all over 30, right?

you ask, "what's the difference between daily and annual"? you are over 10 years old, right?

[Greg Ambrosius]

here is the link to the bill. does anyone see anything separating daily from season long???

http://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/leg ... 97&pn=1572

He's lumped them together right here, where a license is needed to operate any pay-to-play game in Pennsylvania:

"Fantasy sports tournament license." A license issued by the board under this chapter that authorizes a licensed gaming entity to offer fantasy sports tournaments, accept entry fees from participants and award prizes.

[Greg Ambrosius]

here is the link to the bill. does anyone see anything separating daily from season long???

http://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/leg ... 97&pn=1572

I just scanned this document and I can't see anything separating daily vs. season long. As Greg has stated, it appears season-long is at risk. Absolutely ridiculous.

It's totally at risk in states that are trying to create new bills to get a money grab of DFS. They are crafting language that affects ALL pay-to-play fantasy games when UIEGA in 2006 already said fantasy games over a test of time are a game of skill and can be operated with cash prizes. There's a federal law on the books with fantasy carveout language that for the first time ever is being ignored by state legislators with new bills. It's amazing.

The good news is that only one bill has passed, that being a big one in Nevada. Pennsylvania, Georgia, Illinois, Florida and California are crafting bills that would affect season-long fantasy games as well as DFS right now. It's time to let the press know that this is no longer about regulating DFS, it's about a money grab by the states and in turn they are going to kill season-long games as well. Not just high-stakes games with cash prizes, but local leagues as well.

It's time for that grass roots campaign to educate our politicians, who are trying to protect/cater to the state Indian casinos and lotteries at the expense of a legal, 35-year-old industry. Don't let season-long fantasy games be swept up in this so-called DFS regulation process.

[Greg Ambrosius]

I have done some business with casinos here in Nevada mostly in the capacity of bringing softball tournaments into town. I would give them a headcount, number of days stay and simple math on their part they were always accommodating. I'm guessing Greg and Tom run an attractive number of people through Las Vegas every year multiplied by the spend you get real money. Season long in no shape or form pulls money from the casinos I believe daily does. My participation this year in daily sidelined my parlay bets, my season long participation did not. Money was budgeted and was never earmarked for slots, over/unders etc. it's no different than me going to the movies that money would never be used for gambling if they banned movies.

The movers and shakers in Las Vegas are not stupid I find it hard to believe they will let NFBC/NFFC relocate. Key is who's ear do you need. Las Vegas is a great destination city I hope we come to our senses.

Joe, I think you're missing the point: It doesn't matter if we're bringing thousands of sports fans to the city. If this bill tells MGM's legal department that they can't even host a legal fantasy sports contest, the gig is up. MGM and Caesar's won't take the risk to host any fantasy contest and neither will any independent casino. Why? Because they could lose their entire gambling license over this.

I can tell you for a fact that the Nevada Gaming Control Board doesn't know what they can do yet and the casinos certainly don't know what they can do yet, but they will definitely lie on the side of caution. They aren't going to host anything until the Attorney General or the Gaming Control Board gives them approval and right now the language is so vague you don't know what can happen in Vegas hotels or even if Nevada residents can play for cash prizes in season-long games. Right now it looks like Nevada could be the next exempt state.

This opinion was meant to control DFS in Nevada, but right now it's caught everyone. My hope is that we get clearer answers in the next week or so. Until then, keep contacting your local legislators and let's get UEIGA as the law of the land again in all states.

[Greg Ambrosius]

here is the link to the bill. does anyone see anything separating daily from season long???

http://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/leg ... 97&pn=1572

Based upon the news story Greg posted, it specifically stated the original bill was going to be "amended to specifically address daily fantasy sports". See below:

State Representative George Dunbar (R – Westmoreland County) is amending a previous version of House Bill 1197, to specifically address daily fantasy sports. On Monday, Dunbar met with lobbyists representing the widely popular fantasy websites that allow players to wager money on single-day fantasy sports. Dunbar says the industry believes their “skill-based” form of gaming shouldn’t require regulation. He disagrees, saying without regulation on a state level, daily fantasy sites could likely suffer the same fate as online poker, which is now illegal.

So, to me, they are separating the two. No?

The Nevada Attorney General's opinion is specific to DFS, yet the language includes "cash prizes" and "entry fees" given to a provider who then pays cash prizes. Suddenly all of it is vague enough to not only exempt Nevada residents from season-long but hotels from even hosting legal fantasy games. How did it get to this point?

The people crafting the bills are not trying to protect season-long while going after DFS. Every term involving DFS if not spelled out correctly can encompass season-long. But I guess we'll have to wait and see what the amended version is.

Either way, his current version has the prospect of $0 going to the state of Pennsylvania. I can't see the casinos paying $5 million each to host DFS and I can't see DFS companies paying $1 million each to run this through Pennsylvania casinos. And whoever is paying the 14% of winnings in a game that pays 90% isn't happy. It's a lose-lose-lose bill.

[Happenstance]

Greg,

What are the sports themselves (NFL, NBA, MLB etc) and media outlets (ESPN, CBS, etc.) doing from a lobbying effort? I know fantasy sports in general have been a strong catalyst for their growth and so I'd expect them to be putting substantial effort into ensuring that we end up with some form of DFS regulation rather than out-right or de facto bans.

[Greg Ambrosius]

Greg,

What are the sports themselves (NFL, NBA, MLB etc) and media outlets (ESPN, CBS, etc.) doing from a lobbying effort? I know fantasy sports in general have been a strong catalyst for their growth and so I'd expect them to be putting substantial effort into ensuring that we end up with some form of DFS regulation rather than out-right or de facto bans.

I have no idea what is going on behind the scenes. It probably isn't the time for the leagues to be out front of this; that's the job of the DFS companies. But I sure would hope that the legislators putting these state bills forward do their homework on the industry before doing what this guy in Pennsylvania tried. The leagues and DFS companies should all be sending folks to these legislators so that they get it right.

Again, where are the regulations to improve or control DFS in these bills? There are none. Where are the regulations proposed by the industry, or the FSTA? There are none at this point. That's what we need to be focused on, creating guidelines and safeguards in this industry. And then if the states feel this is sports gambling and not part of UIEGA, then deal with that part of the equation. But right now NOBODY is proposing solutions to make DFS better and at the same time season-long is being thrown into the illegal pool.

I think we have a good reporter who has picked up on this angle after seeing all of my Tweets yesterday. Just got done talking with him. Let's see if this helps the situation. Stay tuned.

[Gekko]

IMO, season long contests should be distancing themselves from DFS as quickly as possible. Completely separate games and DFS is 100% IMO going to be regulated and taxed.

[DOUGHBOYS]

IMO, season long contests should be distancing themselves from DFS as quickly as possible. Completely separate games and DFS is 100% IMO going to be regulated and taxed.

Quit copying me!

[Greg Ambrosius]

IMO, season long contests should be distancing themselves from DFS as quickly as possible. Completely separate games and DFS is 100% IMO going to be regulated and taxed.

Ahhhhh, can you help us get that distance in Nevada please? You make it sound like we ride shotgun together.

It's the people making the new rules that don't understand the difference, not the people running the games. Unfortunately, when they write DFS rules and state "paid entries" and "cash prizes" they encompass every pay-to-play game in the industry. It's incredibly frustrating.

[Gekko]

For example the FanDuel contest currently running on the NFFC website.

[Greg Ambrosius]

For example the FanDuel contest currently running on the NFFC website.

And that would help us.....how? If offering a daily game is illegal, we'll stop. It's not illegal!! It's on the wrong side of public opinion right now and states are grabbing for some of the money before it goes away, but nobody has deemed it illegal. Their commercials are driving all of this!!!

But if not running a weekly FanDuel contest on the NFBC site convinces the MGM legal department to allow us to host our drafts in Las Vegas then we'll do it. Go get that done for us. Oh, and stay on top of your stupid Pennsylvania legislator too.

[Gekko]

IMO, season long contests should be distancing themselves from DFS as quickly as possible. Completely separate games and DFS is 100% IMO going to be regulated and taxed.

Quit copying me!

I must have glossed over your post. But it remains a good point. Any kind of a promotional relationship between a daily fantasy company and a season long company can only be a negative (for the season long company). I don't see how it could be helpful to try and convince legislators that a season long contest is completely different from a DFS contest when you have a relationship together. Just my opinion.

[Gekko]

For example the FanDuel contest currently running on the NFFC website.

And that would help us.....how? If offering a daily game is illegal, we'll stop. It's not illegal!! It's on the wrong side of public opinion right now and states are grabbing for some of the money before it goes away, but nobody has deemed it illegal. Their commercials are driving all of this!!!

But if not running a weekly FanDuel contest on the NFBC site convinces the MGM legal department to allow us to host our drafts in Las Vegas then we'll do it. Go get that done for us. Oh, and stay on top of your stupid Pennsylvania legislator too.

http://www.legalsportsreport.com/5173/n ... -gambling/

Nevada Gaming Says Daily Fantasy Sports Is Gambling Under State Law, Illegal To Offer Without State License

[Gekko]

http://www.legalsportsreport.com/5482/s ... sy-sports/

Preet Bharara, the U.S. Attorney behind the Black Friday indictments that permanently altered the landscape of the global online gambling industry, has turned his attention to daily fantasy sports.

That’s per a report from the Wall Street Journal, citing “people familiar with the matter.”

Excerpt:
U.S. Attorney Preet Bharara’s office in the Southern District of New York is investigating whether the business model behind daily fantasy-sports firms like DraftKings Inc. and FanDuel Inc. violates federal law, some of the people said.
The investigation is at an early stage, they added, and even as New York prosecutors try to build their case, senior Justice Department lawyers in Washington are undecided on whether daily fantasy-sports betting violates federal gambling statutes.

[ToddZ]

At least on the surface, Massachusetts is taking what appears to be a reasonable, systematic approach - we'll see what they determine

http://www.bostonglobe.com/business/201 ... story.html

[Greg Ambrosius]

http://www.legalsportsreport.com/5173/n ... -gambling/

Nevada Gaming Says Daily Fantasy Sports Is Gambling Under State Law, Illegal To Offer Without State License

Correct. Nevada residents would be exempt from this type of contest.

Again, if you think season-long games are at peril for working with DFS companies in states that did not exempt them before then that's your opinion. But I can tell you for a fact that the Nevada Gaming Control Board is only looking at what the Attorney General just said about DFS and now applying that decision to all pay-to-play fantasy games.

The hope is that the Gaming Control Board will clarify that position. From what I'm hearing, they are getting strong feedback from Nevada residents about this. But until they say something about this, everything is at a standstill. I hope the industry realizes this and finds a way to seek answers.

Listen in to our opening tonight on the STATS Fantasy Advantage. I might be animated about this point.

[tema213]

I have done some business with casinos here in Nevada mostly in the capacity of bringing softball tournaments into town. I would give them a headcount, number of days stay and simple math on their part they were always accommodating. I'm guessing Greg and Tom run an attractive number of people through Las Vegas every year multiplied by the spend you get real money. Season long in no shape or form pulls money from the casinos I believe daily does. My participation this year in daily sidelined my parlay bets, my season long participation did not. Money was budgeted and was never earmarked for slots, over/unders etc. it's no different than me going to the movies that money would never be used for gambling if they banned movies.

The movers and shakers in Las Vegas are not stupid I find it hard to believe they will let NFBC/NFFC relocate. Key is who's ear do you need. Las Vegas is a great destination city I hope we come to our senses.

Joe, I think you're missing the point: It doesn't matter if we're bringing thousands of sports fans to the city. If this bill tells MGM's legal department that they can't even host a legal fantasy sports contest, the gig is up. MGM and Caesar's won't take the risk to host any fantasy contest and neither will any independent casino. Why? Because they could lose their entire gambling license over this.

I can tell you for a fact that the Nevada Gaming Control Board doesn't know what they can do yet and the casinos certainly don't know what they can do yet, but they will definitely lie on the side of caution. They aren't going to host anything until the Attorney General or the Gaming Control Board gives them approval and right now the language is so vague you don't know what can happen in Vegas hotels or even if Nevada residents can play for cash prizes in season-long games. Right now it looks like Nevada could be the next exempt state.

This opinion was meant to control DFS in Nevada, but right now it's caught everyone. My hope is that we get clearer answers in the next week or so. Until then, keep contacting your local legislators and let's get UEIGA as the law of the land again in all states.

Greg, I'm probably missing something here, but why would the casinos be cautious about hosting anything? They already have the gaming license. Unless it's an issue about where the draft can be held, i.e. it would have to be held on the casino floor instead of the conference rooms that are usually used.

[Greg Ambrosius]

Greg, I'm probably missing something here, but why would the casinos be cautious about hosting anything? They already have the gaming license. Unless it's an issue about where the draft can be held, i.e. it would have to be held on the casino floor instead of the conference rooms that are usually used.[/quote]

Where on the casino floor are our drafts and auctions going to be held? I don't think they're moving the slot machines or craps tables for a fantasy draft.

They don't want to jeopardize their current license by hosting any fantasy draft. I'm not sure if they apply for a DFS license if that allows them to host drafts or not. I'll check, but I'm not sure if Las Vegas casinos will be applying for those or not.

[Edwards Kings]

Reminds me of my days growing up. The only people in the area that wanted to keep the County dry were the Preachers and the bootleggers.

The Georgia "official" leading the charge is from the state lottery council (General Counsel Joseph Kim). It may cause the issue to be brought up in the next legislative session, which will convene in January. The Georgia State Attorney General is a sleazy bastard named Sam Olens, who I think will do do just about anything if he thought he could get at least a two year lease on that big house on West Paces Ferry Road in Atlanta (the Governor's Mansion). I will send him an email as well as have a conversation with my State Representative who just happens to live down the street from me.

What else can WE do Greg?

[KJ Duke]

Greg, I'm probably missing something here, but why would the casinos be cautious about hosting anything? They already have the gaming license. Unless it's an issue about where the draft can be held, i.e. it would have to be held on the casino floor instead of the conference rooms that are usually used.

If all fantasy sports would now be considered a "licensed gaming activity" in Nevada, all game operators would have a set of regulations to follow.

Currently, all operators and manufactuers must be licensed, and every gaming device and table game that they produce/host must go through an approval process. If a new table game is developed or tweaked, it needs specific approval. Likewise for slot machines that have a new type of game play. Casinos can't just start running or hosting a new type of game. Accordingly, there would need to be legal clarity for casinos to host fantasy games now IF Nevada does rule that season-long games are a gaming activity, as they seem to be doing for DFS.

The leagues and media ad business both stand to lose billions, whether they realize it or not, yet. Shutting down fantasy for MLB would probably be as bad as the baseball strike. Let's hope they figure it out soon and get proactive.