Where Did The 2009 NFBC League Champs Draft From?

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Wed Oct 07, 2009 8:23 am

I am currently working on the data for the question above, but I thought I'd start out this thread by showcasing where the Top 25 teams drafted from on D-Day. Interestingly, 13 of the 15 draft spots were represented among the TOP 18 FINISHERS. Only spots 6 and 15 failed to get any team in the Top 25 overall standings.

I'll post the league champions' data on this thread shortly.

But here is the data from the Top 25 teams in total points and where they drafted from:

Top 25 Teams, 2009 Main Event:

No. 1 - 1 team

No. 2 - 2 teams

No. 3 - 2 teams

No. 4 - 3 teams

No. 5 - 2 teams

No. 6 - 0 teams

No. 7 - 2 teams

No. 8 - 3 teams

No. 9 - 1 team

No. 10 - 2 teams

No. 11 - 2 teams

No. 12 - 1 team

No. 13 - 2 teams

No. 14 - 2 teams

No. 15 - 0 teams

1-3: 5 teams

4-6: 5 teams

7-9: 6 teams

10-12: 5 teams

13-15: 4 teams

Albert Pujols was among the top players on Top 25 teams for the second straight year, but he wasn't the No. 1 common denominator. Hanley Ramirez was the top pick on four Top 25 teams, while Pujols, Chase Utley and Ryan Braun were all first round picks of three Top 25 teams. Players picked first by Top 25 teams include:

Hanley Ramirez: 4 times

Albert Pujols: 3 times

Chase Utley: 3 times

Ryan Braun: 3 times

Ryan Howard: 2 times

Mark Teixeira: 2 times

Miguel Cabrera: 2 times

B.J. Upton: 1 time

Jimmy Rollins: 1

Carlos Beltran: 1

Lance Berkman: 1

David Wright: 1

Carl Crawford: 1

The top 4 teams in the Top 25 drafted in Las Vegas this year. LV had 12 teams in the Top 25 (48%), which wasn't far off from the number of teams they had drafting there (42.3%). Chicago had five teams in the Top 25, with three of them coming from Chicago 4. Teams in the Top 25 and where they drafted from include:

Las Vegas: 12 teams

Chicago: 5 teams

New York: 4 teams

Orlando: 2 teams

Phone/Online: 2 teams

sportsbettingman · Post by **sportsbettingman** » Wed Oct 07, 2009 8:26 am

Curious as to how many league winners had guys like Mauer or Hill or the like. Super breakout gifts.

Schwartzstops · Post by **Schwartzstops** » Wed Oct 07, 2009 8:28 am

I won the non-Las Vegas portion of the main event this year (5th overall) despite drafting B.J. Upton in the 1st round! Go figure...

Schwks · Post by **Schwks** » Wed Oct 07, 2009 8:39 am

Interesting...what was rest of your draft?

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Wed Oct 07, 2009 8:47 am

Originally posted by sportsbettingman:

Curious as to how many league winners had guys like Mauer or Hill or the like. Super breakout gifts. Good question. It would take some time to find all of that out, but there's no doubt that guys like Mauer, Justin Verlander, Aaron Hill and even season pickups like Chris Coughlin were mainstays of some championship teams. If you look at Lindy's two title teams, he had Verlander and Clayton Kershaw in both and hit on same late picks like Clint Barmes. That's the key sometimes.

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Wed Oct 07, 2009 8:52 am

The league champions list is a little more top-heavy towards the early part of the draft, which is a bit surprising because injuries to Jose Reyes and David Wright seemed to be pretty damaging, while the back-end of the early rounds looked pretty solid this year. Anyway, the data is in for the 26 main event leagues and it looks like this:

2009 Main Event League Champions & Their Draft Spots:

No. 1: 3 teams

No. 2: 4 teams

No. 3: 2 teams

No. 4: 4 teams

No. 5: 1 team

No. 6: 1 team

No. 7: 2 teams

No. 8: 1 team

No. 9: 1 team

No. 10: 3 teams

No. 11: 1 team

No. 12: 0 teams

No. 13: 2 teams

No. 14: 1 team

No. 15: 0 teams

Spots 1-3: 9 titles

Spots 4-6: 6 titles

Spots 7-9: 4 titles

Spots 10-12: 4 titles

Spots 13-15: 3 titles

** Like the Top 25 overall, 13 of the 15 spots were represented in this analysis. Only picks 12 and 15 failed to produce a league title this year.

** Pujols and Hanley were easily the top two players on league title winners from the first round.

** It's interesting to note that while only 5 teams from spots 1-3 finished in the Top 25, 9 league champs came from those top three spots.

** In the Super Leagues, champions came from spots 4, 3 and 7/14 (tied for first). In the Ultimate League, the champion came from No. 7.

Thoughts?

[ October 07, 2009, 02:53 PM: Message edited by: Greg Ambrosius ]

ThatGuy · Post by **ThatGuy** » Wed Oct 07, 2009 9:34 am

Originally posted by Schwartzstops:

I won the non-Las Vegas portion of the main event this year (5th overall) despite drafting B.J. Upton in the 1st round! Go figure... Hey Schwartzstops, could you post the rest of your draft for us? Very curious.

ZackPhilly · Post by **ZackPhilly** » Thu Oct 08, 2009 6:39 am

Cory is one of the esteemed analysts who compete in NFBC from MLB.com's Fantasy 411 (also seen on The MLB Network)

He did an analysis at the beginning of the year. (For which he was railed pretty good)

NFBC recap - 3/21/09

Drafted 13th - Team Below (from posted .xls file)

Pick#

43.... C.... Martin, Ru. (C)

108... C.... Iannetta, Ch. (C)

18.... 1B... Fielder, Pr. (1)

133... 3B... Encarnacion, Ed. (3)

198... CI... LaRoche, Ad. (1)

253... 2B... Casilla, Al. (2)

78.... SS... Jeter, De. (S)

318... MI... Cabrera, As. (2,S)

313... UT... Rasmus, Co. (O)

13.... OF... Upton, BJ (O)

48.... OF... Victorino, Sh. (O)

223... OF... Spilborghs, Ry. (O)

228... OF... Kubel, Ja. (O)

288... OF... Ross, Co. (O)

138... SP... Nolasco, Ri. (SP)

163... SP... Garza, Ma. (SP)

168... SP... Weaver, Jr. (SP)

193... SP... Rodriguez, Wa. (SP)

283... SP... Saunders, Jo. (SP)

343... SP... Escobar, Ke. (SP)

73.... CL... Nathan, Jo. (RP)

103... CL... Broxton, Jo. (RP)

258... CL... Corpas, Ma. (RP)

And I would think some sort of Post Mortem will be done after some down time (and the Playoffs).

Hav Fun!

2009 NYC LG 3 Champion.

FYI 2008's Analysis;

NFBC recap part one

NFBC recap, part deux

NFBC recap, final thoughts

[ October 08, 2009, 12:49 PM: Message edited by: ZackPhilly ]

Edwards Kings · Post by **Edwards Kings** » Thu Oct 08, 2009 7:33 am

Originally posted by Schwartzstops:

I won the non-Las Vegas portion of the main event this year (5th overall) despite drafting B.J. Upton in the 1st round! Go figure... You are my hero. I got him in the third and he had me crying all year.

Brian Walton · Post by **Brian Walton** » Thu Oct 08, 2009 8:14 am

I may very well be the only top 25 owner and league champ to have taken Crawford (#14 overall) AND B.J. Upton (#17 overall) in the first two rounds. Certainly in the first 17 picks. I didn’t have Mauer, Verlander, Hill, Coughlin or Kershaw!

And I still lived to talk about it!

Brian Walton

CREATiVESPORTS.com

[ October 08, 2009, 02:22 PM: Message edited by: Brian Walton ]

mlbbug · Post by **mlbbug** » Thu Oct 08, 2009 9:22 am

I was able to hang onto a 1.5 point win in NY League 5 despite drafting disappointments like:

D.Wright(1),J.J. Hardy(6),Doumit(8),B. Myers(9), Pie(27),S.Lewis(28).They were offset by Bartlett(21),Zobrist (FA),Blanton(FA),Happ(FA),Randy Wells(FA),Niemann(FA).Just goes to show there is life after draft day!!

Dirt Dogs · Post by **Dirt Dogs** » Thu Oct 08, 2009 9:33 am

Free Agents win leagues!

Gekko · Post by **Gekko** » Thu Oct 08, 2009 9:56 am

Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:

The league champions list is a little more top-heavy towards the early part of the draft, which is a bit surprising because injuries to Jose Reyes and David Wright seemed to be pretty damaging

2009 Main Event League Champions & Their Draft Spots:

No. 1: 3 teams

No. 2: 4 teams

No. 3: 2 teams

No. 4: 4 teams

No. 12: 0 teams

No. 13: 2 teams

No. 14: 1 team

No. 15: 0 teams

Spots 1-4: 13 titles

Spots 12-15: 3 titles

with the competition in the nfbc getting bettr each and every year, maybe it's time to look into 3RR. even with reyes and wright being busts, the early slots 100% killed the late slots. wasn't even close.

NorCalAtlFan · Post by **NorCalAtlFan** » Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:17 am

maybe not that drastic. i like the idea of bidding on draft spots though.

Schwartzstops · Post by **Schwartzstops** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 4:38 am

Originally posted by ZackPhilly:

Cory is one of the esteemed analysts who compete in NFBC from MLB.com's Fantasy 411 (also seen on The MLB Network)

He did an analysis at the beginning of the year. (For which he was railed pretty good)

NFBC recap - 3/21/09

Drafted 13th - Team Below (from posted .xls file)

Pick#

43.... C.... Martin, Ru. (C)

108... C.... Iannetta, Ch. (C)

18.... 1B... Fielder, Pr. (1)

133... 3B... Encarnacion, Ed. (3)

198... CI... LaRoche, Ad. (1)

253... 2B... Casilla, Al. (2)

78.... SS... Jeter, De. (S)

318... MI... Cabrera, As. (2,S)

313... UT... Rasmus, Co. (O)

13.... OF... Upton, BJ (O)

48.... OF... Victorino, Sh. (O)

223... OF... Spilborghs, Ry. (O)

228... OF... Kubel, Ja. (O)

288... OF... Ross, Co. (O)

138... SP... Nolasco, Ri. (SP)

163... SP... Garza, Ma. (SP)

168... SP... Weaver, Jr. (SP)

193... SP... Rodriguez, Wa. (SP)

283... SP... Saunders, Jo. (SP)

343... SP... Escobar, Ke. (SP)

73.... CL... Nathan, Jo. (RP)

103... CL... Broxton, Jo. (RP)

258... CL... Corpas, Ma. (RP)

For the record Zach is also a friend of mine so I appreciate the kind words!

In hindsight I would rate my draft as "OK"... Upton, Martin, Iannetta, Encarnacion and Corpas were just a few that turned out poorly, but then again, Fielder, Broxton, Jeter, Cabrera and Wandy were strong picks. But in reality, as I'm sure was the case for many others, I really won the league in free agency, specifically with these guys:

Date Player $$

4/5 Edwin Jackson $8

4/5 Russell Branyan $15

4/19 Joel Pineiro $1

5/3 Andrew Bailey $21

5/10 Chris Coghlan $95

6/7 Carlos Gonzalez $135

8/30 Juan Uribe $10

I also got valuable contributions at times from guys like Kyle Blanks, Michael Brantley, Carl Pavano, Aaron Laffey and even Mike Hampton! Draft day is important, but it's not the end of the effort, it's only the beginning.

[ October 09, 2009, 10:43 AM: Message edited by: Schwartzstops ]

Asumijet · Post by **Asumijet** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 6:17 am

Originally posted by Gekko:

quote:Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:

The league champions list is a little more top-heavy towards the early part of the draft, which is a bit surprising because injuries to Jose Reyes and David Wright seemed to be pretty damaging

2009 Main Event League Champions & Their Draft Spots:

No. 1: 3 teams

No. 2: 4 teams

No. 3: 2 teams

No. 4: 4 teams

No. 12: 0 teams

No. 13: 2 teams

No. 14: 1 team

No. 15: 0 teams

Spots 1-4: 13 titles

Spots 12-15: 3 titles

with the competition in the nfbc getting bettr each and every year, maybe it's time to look into 3RR. even with reyes and wright being busts, the early slots 100% killed the late slots. wasn't even close. [/QUOTE]Yes, you can win from anywhere, but your draft spot can significantly improve your chances of winning. This data demonstrates that, and an analysis of the TOP 25 and TOP 50 of the contest after week 13 showed the same bias. I looked at week 13 earlier this summer, the results were not as dramatic as the point Mark highlights. But I think the results do demostrate that an advantage to those that had the opportunity to pick Pujols, HRam and Braun. 3RR might be overkill (I emphasize might, as it purely an instinct), but at the very least, we can bid for the KDS draw- one simple bid for the order in which your KDS selections are processed And thus those that get a real or perceived advantage from the draft spot are equalized to some extent from having to pay for the opportunity with FAAB.

Schwks · Post by **Schwks** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 7:01 am

Leaving aside the Reyes, Wright, Sizemore fiascos, (3 of most leagues' top 6 picks) when I was doing mocks and early season drafts, it definitely seemed like the advantage accrued throughout the draft to the early draft pick owners. In other words the picks seemed better during early middle rounds as well. This is NOT sour grapes just thinking out loud. In fact I posted pre-season that it was going to be tougher on those picking later.(I also have been surprised by how much skill in-season trumps draft slotting...but if you have skill plus the right draft slot....)

Chest Rockwell · Post by **Chest Rockwell** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 7:22 am

Originally posted by Asumijet:

quote:Originally posted by Gekko:

quote:Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:

The league champions list is a little more top-heavy towards the early part of the draft, which is a bit surprising because injuries to Jose Reyes and David Wright seemed to be pretty damaging

2009 Main Event League Champions & Their Draft Spots:

No. 1: 3 teams

No. 2: 4 teams

No. 3: 2 teams

No. 4: 4 teams

No. 12: 0 teams

No. 13: 2 teams

No. 14: 1 team

No. 15: 0 teams

Spots 1-4: 13 titles

Spots 12-15: 3 titles

with the competition in the nfbc getting bettr each and every year, maybe it's time to look into 3RR. even with reyes and wright being busts, the early slots 100% killed the late slots. wasn't even close. [/QUOTE]Yes, you can win from anywhere, but your draft spot can significantly improve your chances of winning. This data demonstrates that, and an analysis of the TOP 25 and TOP 50 of the contest after week 13 showed the same bias. I looked at week 13 earlier this summer, the results were not as dramatic as the point Mark highlights. But I think the results do demostrate that an advantage to those that had the opportunity to pick Pujols, HRam and Braun. 3RR might be overkill (I emphasize might, as it purely an instinct), but at the very least, we can bid for the KDS draw- one simple bid for the order in which your KDS selections are processed And thus those that get a real or perceived advantage from the draft spot are equalized to some extent from having to pay for the opportunity with FAAB. [/QUOTE]Well said- there is a great deal of effort to try to keep everyone enthused of the idea you CAN win from any slot. That does not answer the question about is the playing field level. The NFBC is missing the boat on this one big time.

sportsbettingman · Post by **sportsbettingman** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 8:13 am

That brings me back to "is the game itself unfairly set up?"

Rather than screw around endlessly with draft slot allocation...fix the real problem.

...or is it just an Albert Pujols/Ladanian Tomlinson thing?

15 team leagues are more enjoyable to me than 12 team leagues, but if the backlash is MORE advantage to the first slots, then would going to 12 solve that? (I don't know) How were the 12 team league breakdowns?

12 team leagues reduce the advantage of the better players IMO, and that is why they are less popular in those best players eyes.

12 team leagues also have many solid ww players, so the skill is offset again there. (but at least you could add more bench spots!)

12 team leagues also expose the league payouts as poor when there aren't 2 or 3 extra entry fees being inserted when claiming superiority over the league payouts that a 12 team league main event may have.

Just thoughts.

[ October 09, 2009, 02:17 PM: Message edited by: sportsbettingman ]

Gekko · Post by **Gekko** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 8:28 am

the best and most efficient way to allocate draft slots is blind bidding. THE SAME WAY FREE AGENTS ARE ALLOCATED.

you want the hot free agent of the week (or draft slot #1), you need to pay for him. same concept. KDS and/or 3RR are only Band-Aids.

if people can **** away $300 FAAB on Jake Fox or Scott Richmond, they should be able to spend it on something a lot more useful...DRAFT SLOTS!!!

[ October 09, 2009, 02:29 PM: Message edited by: Gekko ]

NorCalAtlFan · Post by **NorCalAtlFan** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 8:30 am

agreed. bidding for draft spots would end a lot of headaches involving kds. not all, but a lot.

sportsbettingman · Post by **sportsbettingman** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 8:48 am

I'm not for tampering with random when generating draft slots, as I feel certain things should not fall into the hands of the players, and league generation and draft slot generation are two of them...but that may be an unpopular opinion.

If you are REQUIRED to understand free agent bidding before week two...you may as well make sure they understand it before the draft!

Imagine the conditional bidding!!!

...now imagine the MB full of complaints when new players didn't fully grasp it and didn't enter their bids correctly.

Nobody wants to tackle the question of "is the 15 team setup unlevel?"

Mostly due to an argument over perceptional advantages ensuing.

Gekko · Post by **Gekko** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:03 am

Originally posted by sportsbettingman:

...now imagine the MB full of complaints when new players didn't fully grasp it and didn't enter their bids correctly.

i call BS on that. you don't see people spending $1,000 or $999 on their first free agent pickup of the year in week one, do you? of course not lance. you must think the average high stakes player has sub 50 IQ

NorCalAtlFan · Post by **NorCalAtlFan** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:13 am

i agree. again. people entering these events are serious players. for the most part. assuming they wouldn't/won't understand the concept of blind bidding isn't giving them or anyone else enough credit.

sportsbettingman · Post by **sportsbettingman** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 11:07 am

Originally posted by Gekko:

quote:Originally posted by sportsbettingman:

...now imagine the MB full of complaints when new players didn't fully grasp it and didn't enter their bids correctly.

i call BS on that. you don't see people spending $1,000 or $999 on their first free agent pickup of the year in week one, do you? of course not lance. you must think the average high stakes player has sub 50 IQ

[/QUOTE]People complain about EVERYTHING. You know that!

Like I said...they had BETTER grasp blind bidding, as it will become very important after the first week of the season completes.

Funny how everyone thinks the draft slot allocation is broke, or isn't fair, or needs to be tweaked...yet have a blind eye on the bigger picture of league size.

Something just tells me the rich want to get richer.

...and I know I'm right when I say that.

The best players have become more vocal in selling tweaks. Every tweak adds to their advantage. When I say best players, what I really mean is the most dedicated/put the most time into it. Time alloted to hobbies is quite varied throughout the player pool.

You can tweak things to a point of Utopia, where everything is in the players hands, and all luck is removed. You'll be left with a Chess tournament...and you know how popular THOSE are! :rolleyes:

I'm not a lotto fan...but games like poker and backgammon are fun...due to their blend of luck and skill. I hope some luck remains in fantasy sports. (aside from the luck on the field of play)

[ October 09, 2009, 05:11 PM: Message edited by: sportsbettingman ]