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For every thought we have in our head when we hear the word 'Yankees', we have the opposite thought when we hear the word 'Cubs'.

The Yankees are winners, the Cubs, losers.

The Yankees are hated, the Cubs, lovable.

The Yankees are tough, the Cubs, soft.

It's easy to hate the Yankees, just as easy to love the Cubs.



The Cubs, at last, may be trying to change their persona. They've hired a trio that built the Boston Red Sox into what they are now.

Beer drinking, chicken eaters.

I kid.

The Red Sox have been the Yankees equal since Epstein, Hoyer, and McLeod were hired in Boston in Boston.



The Cubs do not have the New York Yankees in their way. What is in their way is their past. The organization, the players, the coaches, and their fans say 'Wait till next year' two years in advance.

They're comfortable being lovable.

They're comfortable being losers.



Before Theo & Company, the Red Sox were much the same. Since then, the Red Sox have become Alydar in terms of winning in Major League Baseball, to the Yankees Affirmed.

Epstein takes over a team in need of help in every department.

Free agent pick ups would be the quickest cure.

Epstein says that the key to signing free agents is to 'Pay for future performance, not past performance'

Sounds good.

But, this is also the guy who signed John Lackey to a long term contract.

General Managers should be judged like politicians. We should judge their performance, not their ability to speak of performance.



It's been a long time since Cub fans have had somebody in the front office with a good skill set.

It's a good day for Chicago and their fans. They deserve it.

At best, they have a winner in the front office. Somebody who has 'been there'.

Somebody who hes 'done that'.

At worst, they have a winner in their front office.

Somebody who offers hope to a franchise that has had little over the years.



[ October 25, 2011, 02:42 PM: Message edited by: DOUGHBOYS ]

Theo said all the right things at his press conference. He talked about everyone pulling together to turn this franchise into a World Series championship franchise. He talked about this being done by more than one person. He talked about this being a long process and building from within with a strong scouting department and a deep farm system. He tried his best not to talk about his experience with Boston, even though he needs to reflect on that experience because it was somewhat similar to the Cubs' situation. He gave hope again to Cubs' fans.



And after all, isn't that all Cubs' fans want? Don't they enjoy six months of hope in the off-season as much as they enjoy the sunshine in the bleacher seats? This is a franchise that can win and should win and have winning fans who want more than just beer at the ballpark. It would be good for baseball to see them win. Hell, I never thought the White Sox would win before the Cubs. So even though I'm a Brewers' fan, I'm rooting for Theo to turn things around there.



Now if he signs Fielder and throws all kinds of money around in free agency, I'll feel differently. I'd like to see him build from the ground up and show us a new version of Moneyball that takes 3-5 years to succeed. Let's see a real renaissance through the minor league system and a few smart free agent signings. Then he'd prove how it can be done...for a second time.



This is going to be a fun off-season of baseball even with a weak free agent class. There are enough stars (Pujols and Fielder for sure) to make the big signings interesting and then we'll see what the other franchises do. Theo brings excitement back to Chicago, excitement to the rivalries in the NL Central and hope back for Cubs' fans. Now let's see if his magic works in the Windy City as well as it did in Boston.

Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:

Theo said all the right things at his press conference. He talked about everyone pulling together to turn this franchise into a World Series championship franchise.............



......... I'd like to see him build from the ground up and show us a new version of Moneyball that takes 3-5 years to succeed. In June of 1980 my Dad took me out to Wrigley Field to see the Cubs play the Braves, well…at least that’s why I thought we were there.



But the real reason my dad picked that game was because of the pre-game activities. Prior to the start of the game the Cubs had a promotion that they used to have every year but stopped doing a long time ago, Old-Timers Day.



On this particular day the Old-Timers game was a rematch of the 1945 World Series, Cubs vs Tigers. I can still remember my dad being excited to see the team of his youth take the field lead by Andy Pafko. And even though I can’t remember the words now, I can still hear the passion in his voice as he told me about how his ’45 team was the last time the Cubs made the Series and that how some day they’ll be back there.



That was 30+ years ago. Now I take my daughters to games.



I know it’s unrealistic, and I know every new President/GM/Manager that gets introduced has a 3-5 year plan to win a World Series (although to his credit, Epstein didn’t put an exact timetable on it); but I’m tired of waiting. I want a winner now. My clock with Theo started this morning.



BTW, a couple things I do remember about that Old-Timers Day;



The Tigers won the rematch game just as they won the 1945 World Series.



I know Andy Pafko and Hank Greenberg were there. I kept the program from that day for the longest time and I wish I still had it, but I don’t.



The Cubs played the Braves that day. Not only was there an Old-Timers game, but there also was a Home Run Derby between Cubs great Ernie Banks and Braves great Eddie Mathews. Both had finished their careers with 512 HR’s and this derby would break the tie. If my memory is correct, Mathews won 1-0 over Banks.



The 1980 Cubs lost 98 games that year.



[ October 25, 2011, 05:15 PM: Message edited by: Navel Lint ]

Originally posted by DOUGHBOYS:



The organization, the players, the coaches, and their fans say 'Wait till next year' two years in advance.

They're comfortable being lovable.

They're comfortable being losers.



General Managers should be judged like politicians. We should judge their performance, not their ability to speak of performance.



It's been a long time since Cub fans have had somebody in the front office with a good skill set.

It's a good day for Chicago and their fans. They deserve it.

At best, they have a winner in the front office. Somebody who has 'been there'.

Somebody who hes 'done that'.

At worst, they have a winner in their front office.

Somebody who offers hope to a franchise that has had little over the years. I don't know any Cub fans that are comfortable being losers, at least not since the 1970's ... well, perhaps the little old ladys that just like to come to the park to have someone to talk to, or the drunk guys in the bleachers who are just there to socialize with the drunk girls in bikinis who come there to get a tan.



Dusty got run out of town for not winning. Dallas Green ditto, and Pinella was under constant pressure. All of these had prior success, although I still don't know how Dusty ever won anything after seeing him manage in Chicago.



I hope Theo starts by bringing in a former Cub to manage - tradition and loyalty are very big with Cub fans. After all of the suffering, winning with a hired gun like Dusty or Lou just wouldn't have been right. Hand the team to Joe Girardi like should've been done 3-4 years ago, and if he's not available bring back Sandberg who more than deserves his shot.

In baseball, you just need smart people running the organization and resources (mostly to bury mistakes, which everyone makes).



The Cubs have both now. It's only a matter of time.

As a HUGE Cubs fan since I was a kid watching every game on WGN I could, I can say Cubs fans I know are not ok with being losers. Yes, we hope for next year, but man we want it now!

Hiring Theo was a great start and nobody with a baseball brain thinks this is going to happen fast. If him and Jed build the farm system, slowly gets rid of the bad contracts, and grabs a few pieces off the Free Agent Market... We could be golden!

Like Red Sox Nation that came alive over the last decade, Cubs fans will be coming out of the woodwork to root on a winner at Wrigley!

If I had my wish, we would bring in Sandberg to Manage this team and start the journey to end this 100+ year curse with a legend at the helm!

and i am pretty sure he has the best looking wife of any gm. the cubs now have instant credibility. i really wish the press would lay off ricketts- just what, exactly has he done wrong? they weren't gonna win this year. the guy is building it up one brick at a time.

Bringing Theo in is the best news the Cubs and I as a Cubs fan have had in a long time.



KJ hit it right on the head. Bring in Sandberg and I think they should offer Quade a bench coach position. Don't bring in Pujols, but we do need a first baseman so I would consider Fielder if we could dump Soriano's contract off on some other team. We also need a 3B and pitching.



It will take him time, but this time truly there will be no more wait til next year. It's coming and the city of Chicago will never be the same after they win!

I will say that Theo is a solid GM, but the most overrated. We should have a better understanding in 5 to 7 years if he is a good as everyone thinks. This is not the same situation as the one he took over in Boston. The Red Sox foundation to win was already put together by the very underrated Dan Dequette, who deserves more credit for the Red Sox winning.



By the way Dan Dequette is a better GM than Theo!!

I don't know if that's right, Kelly. It's like saying Brian Cashman is overrated. Cashman and Epstein have resources that are not available to other teams, so I don't know if they're overrated or not, they just play a different game than other GM's.

What I do know is that both have won. Granted, a lot of that has to do with those resources.



Several people with just a little baseball knowledge have approached me locally after seeing 'Money Ball' and think that Billy Beane is wonderful.

While they're raving about Beane, my mind goes to how the A's haven't finished over .500 the last five years or even been a relevant team during that time period.

Theo said yesterday that 10 years in one job as a GM is long enough. I think he is right. GM's are like politicians, they seem to stagnate in one job too long.

With the movie making new baseball fans, Beane is great for baseball now.

At the same time, his contract ends next year.

It'll be interesting to see how that is handled in Oakland because he now owns a small part of the team.

Maybe, part owner Beane will realize that GM Beane has to move on.

Originally posted by Navel Lint:

quote:Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:

Theo said all the right things at his press conference. He talked about everyone pulling together to turn this franchise into a World Series championship franchise.............



......... I'd like to see him build from the ground up and show us a new version of Moneyball that takes 3-5 years to succeed. In June of 1980 my Dad took me out to Wrigley Field to see the Cubs play the Braves, well…at least that’s why I thought we were there.



But the real reason my dad picked that game was because of the pre-game activities. Prior to the start of the game the Cubs had a promotion that they used to have every year but stopped doing a long time ago, Old-Timers Day.



On this particular day the Old-Timers game was a rematch of the 1945 World Series, Cubs vs Tigers. I can still remember my dad being excited to see the team of his youth take the field lead by Andy Pafko. And even though I can’t remember the words now, I can still hear the passion in his voice as he told me about how his ’45 team was the last time the Cubs made the Series and that how some day they’ll be back there.



That was 30+ years ago. Now I take my daughters to games.



I know it’s unrealistic, and I know every new President/GM/Manager that gets introduced has a 3-5 year plan to win a World Series (although to his credit, Epstein didn’t put an exact timetable on it); but I’m tired of waiting. I want a winner now. My clock with Theo started this morning.



BTW, a couple things I do remember about that Old-Timers Day;



The Tigers won the rematch game just as they won the 1945 World Series.



I know Andy Pafko and Hank Greenberg were there. I kept the program from that day for the longest time and I wish I still had it, but I don’t.



The Cubs played the Braves that day. Not only was there an Old-Timers game, but there also was a Home Run Derby between Cubs great Ernie Banks and Braves great Eddie Mathews. Both had finished their careers with 512 HR’s and this derby would break the tie. If my memory is correct, Mathews won 1-0 over Banks.



The 1980 Cubs lost 98 games that year. [/QUOTE]I have a different memory of 1980. I was born a Cubs fan, Was heartbroken in 69,70,71,72, and even 73. 74 started the rebuilding and I remained loyal. Suffered through some hard to watch baseball. Alas it's hard to rebuild when you don't have a minor league system. They did have a couple decent years with Herman Franks as manager. He managed to come close (contention till August with poor teams) a couple times in the late 70's. But 1980 was the last straw for me. Remembering 1980 it's hard to believe they only lost 98. Having to play in places like Busch and the Vet with a platoon if Mike Vail and Greg Gross in center. Neither were competent left fielders and the usual Cub slow afoot. Patroling cf on Astro turf in those places was a travesty. Even Billy Buckner caring only about winning a batting title. The team quit, not the only Cub team I've seen do that. I just couldn't stand it anymore and have not cared whether they win or lose since. They broke me. I wish them success with Theo. Even though I rooted against them through most of the Sandberg years (hated Green/Elia). I think they should hire him, though Theo apparently is looking elsewhere. He deserves it. Put in his dues managing in the minors as he was asked. Won even with maginal talent playing for him, then got screwed. I have absolutely nothing against a baseball lifer getting his chance, but Quade was part of the problem both in the minors and majors. He was a poor manager and far too tollerent of players not playing the right way. Maybe this will be the Cubs century. Theo and co s/b an improvement. I've always been convinced winning starts at the top. Sorry though, patience will be required. You just can't fix this mess in 1 or 2 years. A whole new culture is required. I hope Castro is still savable. Playing next to the cancer at 3b last year won't do him any good. Glad to hear Theo doesn't want him back. BTW when Castro was called out last year in the Sunday night game Aramis was first to his rescue which figures. Actually putting forth your best effort or actually looking toward home plate as the pitch is delivered is not required to play for Quade or the Cubs. As for Aramis I forgive him for his many base running blunders this year. After all it's been a few years since his last contract year so he hasn't actually run the bases in several years. So I deemed him out of practice, or maybe he just forgot how. I thought he may have forgotten how to run at all. Ok so he's not fast, but he can actaully move faster than a slow jog. Though completely clueless on base running fundementals. It's not an accident or bad luck that the Cubs lose year after year. They play to lose. They don't play winning baseball. Fielding, hitting, baserunning, or management. They've had a long succecion of losers. Remenber the Cub motto "thou shalt not walk". Swing at the pitch bouncing in or over your head with a 3-0 count, but don't let the pitcher give you 1st base. I've heard you can't walk off the island, but apparently you can't walk at Wrigley field either.

Theo better make some good decisions fast because he's already off on the wrong foot with Cub fans with Sandberg. Joe Girardi didn't have managing experience when the Yanks hired him.



I am really hoping we don't get another no-balls manager choice out of Epstein like the hiring of Pinella.

Originally posted by KJ Duke:

Theo better make some good decisions fast because he's already off on the wrong foot with Cub fans with Sandberg. Joe Girardi didn't have managing experience when the Yanks hired him.



I am really hoping we don't get another no-balls manager choice out of Epstein like the hiring of Pinella. Ding. ding. ding! You speak for Cubs fans KJ!!!!

Originally posted by WINSTON'S EMPIRE:

quote:Originally posted by KJ Duke:

Theo better make some good decisions fast because he's already off on the wrong foot with Cub fans with Sandberg. Joe Girardi didn't have managing experience when the Yanks hired him.



I am really hoping we don't get another no-balls manager choice out of Epstein like the hiring of Pinella. Ding. ding. ding! You speak for Cubs fans KJ!!!! [/QUOTE]Well… he doesn’t speak for all of us.



I wanted the Cubs to hire Epstein because I think he has what it takes to build a championship team in Chicago. I’m not ready to start criticizing him already for not doing something (hire Sandberg). At this point I have to put my trust in him that he will make the right decision and hire the best available manager. Since most Cubs fan really wanted Theo here because of his successful run with Boston, it seems a little goofy to suggest that he’s already wrong. If your questioning his first move, maybe he shouldn't have been your guy,



I’d actually love to see Bob Brenly get a shot.

Originally posted by KJ Duke:

Theo better make some good decisions fast because he's already off on the wrong foot with Cub fans with Sandberg. Joe Girardi didn't have managing experience when the Yanks hired him.



. Except for that time he managed the Marlins

Originally posted by LONG GONE:

I will say that Theo is a solid GM, but the most overrated. We should have a better understanding in 5 to 7 years if he is a good as everyone thinks. This is not the same situation as the one he took over in Boston. The Red Sox foundation to win was already put together by the very underrated Dan Dequette, who deserves more credit for the Red Sox winning.



By the way Dan Dequette is a better GM than Theo!! As a big Red Sox fan I couldnt agree more. Theo Epstein is vastly over rated. here is a link from the boston globe. its a poll on his best and worst FA signings. the most pathetic thing is that i guess they thought that jd drew needed to be on the good side because they needed to even the listings.

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/r ... s_surveys/



Taking chances on david ortiz and adrian beltre were really good. ortiz was brilliant. Blll Mueller and Kevin Millar? they were just the right pieces at the right the time. Take note of the superstar signings. All flubs. But I can say he is aggressive.



Good luck Cubbies. I think the great news is that you got hoyer and the other guy. 3 really good baseball brains.

Apparently, Ryno and Francona have been ruled out as managerial prospects in Chitown. Three great organizations are looking for managers. It'll be interesting to see who goes where. I think Oquendo will get the shot in St. Louis. Wouldn't be surprised to see Girardi on the move to Chicago. Boston, I have no idea. I personally think Scosia is one of the best, could he be on the move?

Originally posted by Navel Lint:

quote:Originally posted by WINSTON'S EMPIRE:

quote:Originally posted by KJ Duke:

Theo better make some good decisions fast because he's already off on the wrong foot with Cub fans with Sandberg. Joe Girardi didn't have managing experience when the Yanks hired him.



I am really hoping we don't get another no-balls manager choice out of Epstein like the hiring of Pinella. Ding. ding. ding! You speak for Cubs fans KJ!!!! [/QUOTE]Well… he doesn’t speak for all of us.



I wanted the Cubs to hire Epstein because I think he has what it takes to build a championship team in Chicago. I’m not ready to start criticizing him already for not doing something (hire Sandberg). At this point I have to put my trust in him that he will make the right decision and hire the best available manager. Since most Cubs fan really wanted Theo here because of his successful run with Boston, it seems a little goofy to suggest that he’s already wrong. If your questioning his first move, maybe he shouldn't have been your guy,



I’d actually love to see Bob Brenly get a shot. [/QUOTE]I am just a big Sandberg fan and think he would be a great manager. The team is starting at the bottom here, why not give him a chance? I do trust in Theo and think him bringing in Hoyer to help him out as GM was brilliant. Whoever they pick will have to better than the managers they have had. We will see!!!!

Originally posted by Navel Lint:

quote:Originally posted by WINSTON'S EMPIRE:

quote:Originally posted by KJ Duke:

Theo better make some good decisions fast because he's already off on the wrong foot with Cub fans with Sandberg. Joe Girardi didn't have managing experience when the Yanks hired him.



I am really hoping we don't get another no-balls manager choice out of Epstein like the hiring of Pinella. Ding. ding. ding! You speak for Cubs fans KJ!!!! [/QUOTE]Well… he doesn’t speak for all of us.



I wanted the Cubs to hire Epstein because I think he has what it takes to build a championship team in Chicago. I’m not ready to start criticizing him already for not doing something (hire Sandberg). At this point I have to put my trust in him that he will make the right decision and hire the best available manager. Since most Cubs fan really wanted Theo here because of his successful run with Boston, it seems a little goofy to suggest that he’s already wrong. If your questioning his first move, maybe he shouldn't have been your guy,



I’d actually love to see Bob Brenly get a shot. [/QUOTE]Ah yeah, the Marlins stint.



I'll judge Theo when I see what and who be brings. But not even interviewing Sandberg is to me strike one. Girardi would be a home run, even better than Sandberg. Although I'd live to see Joe then bring in Ryne as a bench coach.



Some old big name coach who's living off his past success from what was a strong organization and team ... that would be strike two.



[ November 03, 2011, 06:34 PM: Message edited by: KJ Duke ]