THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

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DOUGHBOYS
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THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

Post by DOUGHBOYS » Tue Feb 24, 2015 10:44 am

Quick, how many Yankees are being taken in the first five rounds of fantasy drafts?
It's sad.
The answer is one. Jacoby Ellsbury.
The Yankees are no longer THE YANKEES.
And it's funny, the media still treats them like THE YANKEES.
Since the real Steinbrenner left us, the Yankees have become... :o ...average.

They still go out and buy players. They just do it at a lesser rate. This year, they bought Didi Gregorius and Stephen Drew and Andrew Miller and Chase Headley.
Nothing wrong with that...except almost ANY team could have done that!
Those aren't the signing of Yankees lore. More like a midwest team.
The Yankees charge their customers more than any other team in baseball. Those customers EXPECT that team to go out and use that money for high priced talent....and they get Didi Gregorius.

The elder Steinbrenner knew how to sell the Yankees. In a word, under his sons, the Yankees have become... :o ...boring.
If anything, George would have used ARod as either a whipping boy or used him as a lightning rod for attention. Now, the Yankees as quietly as possible have ARod come into camp.

Do you think the elder Steinbrenner would have let Scherzer go? And then Shields?
Especially when their top three in the rotation of Tanaka, Sabathia, and Pineda all have a chance to be injured not to throw many innings this year?
Threenut Brittle.

Teixeira and Beltran and ARod are starting only because they have expensive contracts.
They are former lynchpins who have turned to safety pins.
The elder Steinbrenner would not have stood for it. These players have small chance of being a heavy contributor to the Yankees this year.
The Yankees give seven year or eight year contracts to secure these players. In the past, they didn't really expect players to fulfill these long contracts. They have gotten their usefullness from Teixeira and ARod. Beltran looks to be a bad buy.
It is hard to picture the elder Steinbrenner forcing fans to watch these crochety old men on the field, because HE couldn't stand it, himself.

But now, the Yankees are average. They resemble the Phils organization now, more than the Red Sox.
The Red Sox were smart enough to get rid of their bad buys. Adrian Gonzalez, Crawford, and Beckett are not hanging around and keeping younger and more able players from taking those positions.
Even the Cubs have gotten rid of bad contracts while the Yankees bring back players close to crutches.
And new contracts?
Other teams are buying Moncada, Castillo, Puig, Abreu, Iglesias, Tomas, and other Latin hopefuls. Not the Yankees.
The younger Steinbrenners worry about a luxury tax and staying within budget.
The elder Steinbrenner just wanted to win.

I'm not a fan of any team, but through my life, I've had an admiration for the Yankees.
The Yankees equaled greatness.
The Yankees through history always seemed to have that one polarizing player. That one player that all of America could identify with or emulate or fantasize that they were him.
Babe Ruth to Lou Gehrig to Joe DiMaggio to Yogi Berra to Whitey Ford to Mickey Mantle to Roger Maris to George Steinbrenner to Thurman Munson to Reggie Jackson to Ron Guidry to Mo Rivera to Andy Pettitte to ARod to Derek Jeter to ???

The Yankees are a team without a leader. Ellsbury is still thought by most baseball fans as a former Red Sox more than a current Yankee. ARod has never been a leader. Alex thinks of himself as SuperMan and continues to wonder why he is not more revered. Succinctly, ARod has enough to worry about in his own world to be a leader of others.
Teixeira and Beltran are playing out the string and hope to see the field for half their games.
It's sad.
If their top three pitchers stay healthy, the Yankees can compete.
That's it, just compete.
But beyond that, we expect little.
Expecting little, was the opposite of what George Steinbrenner visualized for any Yankee team.
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ALL-IN JD
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Re: THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

Post by ALL-IN JD » Tue Feb 24, 2015 4:25 pm

Dan,

I agree with much of what you said but I do see things a little differently (granted I am a die hard Yankee fan). While it is run way more like a "business" now I believe there is a method to the madness. Of course I want them to win every year but I am a realist. I am okay with them making the moves they are making, HOPE things work out for a push during the year, and patiently wait for those three albatross' of a contract be done. There is ZERO doubt in my mind that as the contracts of Sabathia, A Roid and Tex come off the books things will back CLOSE to "normal". Of course that might be wishful thinking but that's what I think will happen. I am prepared for a few more lean years to no doubt get back to the promised land.

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Re: THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

Post by Roy's Outlaws » Tue Feb 24, 2015 6:09 pm

J.D. , I as a big Yankees fan have a different take on what the KIDS (George's)are doing. they are sucking as much cash out of the team as the can, (selling the YES network , that was a cash cow) making huge memorabilia deal with Steiner, they will sell ANYTHING in the stadium now. I think they are setting up to SELL the team in the next 3-5 years. Their heart is NOT into it like the old man. Who would stop at nothing to WIN (Cost be dammed)

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Re: THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

Post by DOUGHBOYS » Tue Feb 24, 2015 6:14 pm

THAT was my point, Jeff.
There were no lean years with George. Sure, they didn't win every year, but it wasn't because of a lack of resources.
Why should Yankee fans come to see dinosaurs in the last years of contracts?
George would have signed somebody with a name to keep the interest. Headley, Drew, Miller, and Gregorius are fodder.
They're supposed to be playing for other teams, not the Yankees.
The Yankees stood for the best, wait a couple of years till contracts die? That is for the Phillies of the world!
Not the YANKEES!
The Yankees would make fans forget about contracts with even bigger contracts.....AND WIN.
An endless amount of money could do that.
Now, now that money is not going back on the field. They are being outbid for Cuban and Latin players left and right.
Before, it was an oddity when the Yankees did NOT get a big player. Now, it's an oddity when they do.
There is no excitement in the Bronx.
Unless calling a 39 year old player like ARod, 'exciting'.
I asked a baseball fan to name three Yankees really quick....two....one
He could not think of even one name right away.
That says it all.
The Yankees can sell their fans that they have to run the team 'like a business'.
But, they used to run their team to win.
And if that change is so, the YANKEES truly are gone. And the Yankees are here.
And George is rolling over in his grave.
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Re: THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

Post by whale4evr » Tue Feb 24, 2015 6:23 pm

For those pining for George, remember the Yankees had most of their success (late 90's) after George was suspended and Gene Michael built the farm system. Would that success have happened anyway? Maybe Rivera, Posada and Jeter would have been used to get veterans like Rijo, Buhner and Mcgriff were if George had his way.

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Re: THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

Post by DOUGHBOYS » Tue Feb 24, 2015 6:30 pm

whale4evr wrote:For those pining for George, remember the Yankees had most of their success (late 90's) after George was suspended and Gene Michael built the farm system. Would that success have happened anyway? Maybe Rivera, Posada and Jeter would have been used to get veterans like Rijo, Buhner and Mcgriff were if George had his way.
Who hired Michael? And fired Michael?
And hired Michael? :D
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Re: THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

Post by Red Sox Nation- » Tue Feb 24, 2015 6:46 pm

Roy's Outlaws wrote:J.D. , I as a big Yankees fan have a different take on what the KIDS (George's)are doing. they are sucking as much cash out of the team as the can, (selling the YES network , that was a cash cow) making huge memorabilia deal with Steiner, they will sell ANYTHING in the stadium now. I think they are setting up to SELL the team in the next 3-5 years. Their heart is NOT into it like the old man. Who would stop at nothing to WIN (Cost be dammed)
Mike Lupica was on WEEI this AM and this was his take. He feels they are getting ready to sell the team as well.

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Re: THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

Post by DOUGHBOYS » Tue Feb 24, 2015 6:48 pm

Red Sox Nation- wrote:
Roy's Outlaws wrote:J.D. , I as a big Yankees fan have a different take on what the KIDS (George's)are doing. they are sucking as much cash out of the team as the can, (selling the YES network , that was a cash cow) making huge memorabilia deal with Steiner, they will sell ANYTHING in the stadium now. I think they are setting up to SELL the team in the next 3-5 years. Their heart is NOT into it like the old man. Who would stop at nothing to WIN (Cost be dammed)
Mike Lupica was on WEEI this AM and this was his take. He feels they are getting ready to sell the team as well.
It sure is noticeable in their (lack of) spending on players.
In the end, this could make for a lot better situation for the Yankees.
Of course, depending on the new owners.
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Re: THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

Post by Roy's Outlaws » Tue Feb 24, 2015 6:57 pm

Dan , that new owner could be Mark Cuban ? But baseball been trying to keep him out for years. He wanted to buy the Cubs, the owner won't approve him.

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Re: THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

Post by DOUGHBOYS » Tue Feb 24, 2015 7:01 pm

Roy's Outlaws wrote:Dan , that new owner could be Mark Cuban ? But baseball been trying to keep him out for years. He wanted to buy the Cubs, the owner won't approve him.
That would be GREAT for the Yankees, Roy.
But I don't think it would be approved.
It's not like the old days when it was easy to own multiple franchises in sports.
Jack Kent Cooke really had a blast doing that.
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Re: THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

Post by whale4evr » Tue Feb 24, 2015 7:20 pm

DOUGHBOYS wrote:
whale4evr wrote:For those pining for George, remember the Yankees had most of their success (late 90's) after George was suspended and Gene Michael built the farm system. Would that success have happened anyway? Maybe Rivera, Posada and Jeter would have been used to get veterans like Rijo, Buhner and Mcgriff were if George had his way.
Who hired Michael? And fired Michael?
And hired Michael? :D
Stick was a Yankee long before George and his group bought the team having come up through their system when CBS owned them. He has been (and still is) a Yankee for life. People who think the Yankee success was all about George need to look a little deeper. George had all the bluster but many others had/have the brains.

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Re: THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

Post by DOUGHBOYS » Tue Feb 24, 2015 7:33 pm

Understood. It wasn't about George's smarts at all.
It was about attitude.
He had enough money. He was Happy.
And it made him happier to win rather than store away money like his son's. And Yankee fans were happy to go for the ride.
I have to be careful in maximizing Steinbrenners significance to the Yankees, sure.
At the same time, minimizing that significance is not the road to travel either.

PS- Stick did leave the Yanks to Manage the Cubs. He was re-hired by the Yankees again.
But believe me, I know that is not the point and I get your point.
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Re: THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

Post by Bronx Yankees » Wed Feb 25, 2015 7:53 am

I agree with most of the above comments. As a die-hard Yankees fan, I have found the team tough to watch the last few years. I loved those late-90's teams, and have thoroughly enjoyed watching guys like Jeter and Rivera have HOF careers even when the team competed for a title but did not win.

George never would have stood pat the way the Yankees did this offseason. They would have signed Scherzer or at least Shields. There also is no way guys like Castillo, Tomas, Moncada, etc., would have come into the league under an open bidding process and have the Yankees sign zero of them. To the give the sons' credit, they stepped up last year in signing Ellsbury, McCann, Tanaka, and Beltran, although they lost Cano and A-Rod got suspended which freed up cash. That being said, those signings only marginally approved a mediocre team, and they needed to do more this off-season. Hell, Brandon McCarthy wanted to stay with the Yankees and they couldn't even sign him.

The ticket (and food) prices at Yankees Stadium are exorbitant. The Yankees could get away with charging those types of prices when they put a superior (and likeable) team out on the field every day. Now, not so much. At times, it is embarrassing to watch Yankees games and see the majority of the premium seats right behind home plate empty.

While I sometimes had mixed feelings about George - and thought he was more effective when he "settled down" some and let Torre manage and the front office develop young talent - you never doubted his incredible will to win, and always be relevant. You just do not sense that from his sons, and so I guess it is a case, for me at least, of not fully appreciating George until he was gone. I also now have a better understanding of the importance of ownership than when I was a kid just rooting for my teams. If the sons are going to sell, let's hope it is to the right owner. I think #2 might have enough socked away (and perhaps we could make Hannah the permanent first lady/swimsuit model of the Yankees). :D

Mike
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Re: THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

Post by DOUGHBOYS » Thu Feb 26, 2015 8:48 am

All this Yankees talk has one of my favorite all-time trivia questions come to mind...

Of pitchers with 15 wins or more against them, who had the highest winning percentage vs. the Yankees?

Hint: This pitcher had two seasons of winning at least 20 games.
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Re: THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

Post by Navel Lint » Thu Feb 26, 2015 1:01 pm

DOUGHBOYS wrote:All this Yankees talk has one of my favorite all-time trivia questions come to mind...

Of pitchers with 15 wins or more against them, who had the highest winning percentage vs. the Yankees?

Hint: This pitcher had two seasons of winning at least 20 games.
That's a good question, I had to cheat and do some research to find the answer.

As for the Yankees, I don't think they are ever gonna just shut it down and do a total rebuild like the Cubs just spent the last three years doing. Yankee fans won't live with that like Cubs fans have.
I think they are doing a modified version (which almost never works).
The crazy thing is, the AL East might be the worst division in baseball this year and the Yankees could still pull off a division title with one more pitcher and a little luck.
Russel -Navel Lint

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Re: THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

Post by DOUGHBOYS » Thu Feb 26, 2015 3:08 pm

It is a wonderful question, one that has bought me a bag of Doritos or two in wagers.
I'll post the answer tomorrow to let others think about it.

Russ, I agree about the A.L. East. I was astounded at a draft where only two A.L. East Starters (Tanaka and Cobb) went in the first 10 rounds.
This is a division of hitters ball parks. That division should do their best to keep scores up and pitchers stats rising.
Who's the best team?
I don't know.
The Red Sox and Jays have wonderful hitters. The Orioles and Yankees are both question marks and Tampa is going to have to win a lot of close games to even compete.
Getting back to pitching, the bullpens aren't anything to write home about either.
Betances will be an untested Closer. Miller has been hurt or under performed a lot in his career.
The Orioles have a one year Closer in Britton, the others are an assortment of 'could be's.
The Jays are still trying to formulate a bullpen. Brett Cecil, Aaron Sanchez, or Jon Papelbon could be closing. They don't really know.
The Rays have an injury with McGee and lost Peralta.
The Red Sox have oldsters Uehara, Tazawa, and Mujica coming back. Nothing fearful.
Unless a break out pitcher or two make a big difference, it looks to be a division of best hitters, win.
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Re: THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

Post by DOUGHBOYS » Fri Feb 27, 2015 1:20 pm

Answer to the trivia question:

Babe Ruth. 17-5 against the Yankees.

When thinking about it, fate smiled on Ruth.
He got to pitch during the dead ball era and hit during the live ball era.
Not a knock on him, baseball fans wouldn't change a thing.
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Re: THE YANKEES have turned to the Yankees

Post by TOXIC ASSETS » Mon Mar 09, 2015 5:16 pm

If Tanaka goes down with an elbow injury early in the year, I believe the Yankees could rival the Phillies for the worst record in the league this season. It's that bad in the Bronx. Team is being killed by not only the terrible A Rod contract, but Sabathia, Texiera, and Beltran's contracts as well. Basically they have reverted to what the Yankees used to do before the great run started in 1996. Even if Tanaka somehow manages to stay healthy all year, it says here that Yanks go no better than 81-81.

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