Gekko - Fireside Chat_-_CATCHERS

Captain Hook · Post by **Captain Hook** » Wed Jan 02, 2008 2:59 pm

Dan, no offense taken, but the writer has been one of the top sportswriters in the LA area for years and files stories for MLB.com which appear on the Dodgers own web site - certainly doesn't mean that they are Torre's lineup, but he does have access to Torre and every member of the Dodger's staff.

In addition the two hole is a very logical position for Martin and the Dodgers don't have a better player for that spot unless it's Furcal and then who would lead off? You certainly don't want to imply that it is going to be Pierre.

The LAD/CWS rumor has been around for a while - it certainly doesn't mean that the Dodgers don't view LaRoche as a long term solution but may have doubts about his readiness for full time duty in 08. In addition the trade makes even more sense, regardless of how much they have to subsidize the White Sox for part of Pierre's remaining contract.

It's all spec for now, but we will see. There is NO lock for 3B in Los Angeles at this point.

KJ Duke · Post by **KJ Duke** » Wed Jan 02, 2008 3:32 pm

Current dodger line-up in my projections:

1 furcal

2 martin

3 kemp

4 kent

5 a jones

6 loney/nomar

7 laroche/nomar/ethier

8 pierre/laroche

Furcal and Martin up top should be close to fixed; having a good RBI guy in Kent protecting Kemp makes sense too, although Loney and Nomar should see some time in the 3hole too. Loney or Nomar (and sometimes Kemp) at #6 also is likely, providing protection for their HR hitter in Andruw. Pierre should be, and I think will be hitting 8th if he's still in LA, with LaRoche getting pushed down there when Ethier is playing.

Plymouth · Post by **Plymouth** » Wed Jan 02, 2008 5:03 pm

I have a hard time picturing Torre putting a guy in the 3 hole who has never had 300 at bats in a single season.

KJ Duke · Post by **KJ Duke** » Wed Jan 02, 2008 6:21 pm

Originally posted by Plymouth:

I have a hard time picturing Torre putting a guy in the 3 hole who has never had 300 at bats in a single season. Kemp is a power & speed guy, so you certainly don't want him hitting behind a slow-footed 40 yr-old Kent; you also want him to see good pitches and have him hitting higher than Andruw (who will hit for a lower avg and doesn't run). So the 3-hole seems most logical. Maybe he hits cleanup and they drop Kent and Andruw to 5/6, but that seems a little less likely to me based on the veteran status of Kent and the contract of Jones.

DOUGHBOYS · Post by **DOUGHBOYS** » Wed Jan 02, 2008 7:13 pm

I've realized through this thread how little I think of Major League Managers.

I don't think that the Dodgers will trade Pierre and I do think that Torre will hit him second. Its the wrong thing to do but every other Manager has hit Pierre there or leadoff and I don't see Torre changing the trend.

It's hard to put Towles on my lists. Has there been a more horrid 7-8-9 over the last five years than Everett-Ausmus-Pitcher? I still have that doubt that the Astros will play Towles on a regular basis. Haven't heard from the Houston writers have you, Perry?

Edwards Kings · Post by **Edwards Kings** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 3:45 am

Is it me, or is Everett in a different zip code now (i.e. Minnesota)? Or were you referring to last year?

On Houston, Berkman, Carlos Lee, Pence, Tejada, and Wigginton could be pretty darn good with Bourn, K. Matsui (I know, OBP reeks)and Towles filling in around the ends.

[ January 03, 2008, 09:46 AM: Message edited by: Edwards Kings ]

Captain Hook · Post by **Captain Hook** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 3:46 am

Projected Astros starting lineup (obviously as of now) by Alyson Footer (Houston writer) for MLB as posted on the Astros website:

CF Michael Bourn

2B Kazuo Matsui

SS Miguel Tejada

1B Lance Berkman

LF Carlos Lee

RF Hunter Pence

3B Ty Wigginton

C J.R. Towles

SP Roy Oswalt

Certainly Wigginton, Towles and P is better than Everett, Ausmus and P Dan............

DOUGHBOYS · Post by **DOUGHBOYS** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 4:47 am

Originally posted by Edwards Kings:

Is it me, or is Everett in a different zip code now (i.e. Minnesota)? Or were you referring to last year?

Yes, of course, the last few years actually.

On Houston, Berkman, Carlos Lee, Pence, Tejada, and Wigginton could be pretty darn good with Bourn, K. Matsui (I know, OBP reeks)and Towles filling in around the ends. A heckuva lot better than the last few years for sure. Can any of these guys pitch?

DOUGHBOYS · Post by **DOUGHBOYS** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 4:55 am

Originally posted by Captain Hook:

Projected Astros starting lineup (obviously as of now) by Alyson Footer (Houston writer) for MLB as posted on the Astros website:

CF Michael Bourn

2B Kazuo Matsui

SS Miguel Tejada

1B Lance Berkman

LF Carlos Lee

RF Hunter Pence

3B Ty Wigginton

C J.R. Towles

SP Roy Oswalt

Certainly Wigginton, Towles and P is better than Everett, Ausmus and P Dan............ Thanks Perry and you are certainly correct.

Edwards Kings · Post by **Edwards Kings** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 6:11 am

Originally posted by DOUGHBOYS:

quote:Originally posted by Edwards Kings:

Is it me, or is Everett in a different zip code now (i.e. Minnesota)? Or were you referring to last year?

Yes, of course, the last few years actually.

On Houston, Berkman, Carlos Lee, Pence, Tejada, and Wigginton could be pretty darn good with Bourn, K. Matsui (I know, OBP reeks)and Towles filling in around the ends. A heckuva lot better than the last few years for sure. Can any of these guys pitch? [/QUOTE]You mean pitch better than Woody and Wandy? Probably!

bjoak · Post by **bjoak** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 6:22 am

Originally posted by DOUGHBOYS:

quote:Originally posted by Edwards Kings:

Is it me, or is Everett in a different zip code now (i.e. Minnesota)? Or were you referring to last year?

Yes, of course, the last few years actually.

On Houston, Berkman, Carlos Lee, Pence, Tejada, and Wigginton could be pretty darn good with Bourn, K. Matsui (I know, OBP reeks)and Towles filling in around the ends. A heckuva lot better than the last few years for sure. Can any of these guys pitch? [/QUOTE]They can't play defense so they might as well do something on the field. Funny that Ausmus was the only defender that they valued inappropriately (besides Biggio who was bad at everything as his career wound down) and he is the one that was left on the team. As much as Ed Wade isn't putting a premium on, working for, or even noting his defense, I'd assume he is 100% behind Towles.

DOUGHBOYS · Post by **DOUGHBOYS** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 6:46 am

I've circled the Milwaukee-Houston series on my calendar. Those lineups, those defenses, and a pitching matchup of Chris Capuano and Woody Williams, the game may never end.

CC's Desperados · Post by **CC's Desperados** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 7:38 am

Originally posted by DOUGHBOYS:

quote:Originally posted by Captain Hook:

Projected Astros starting lineup (obviously as of now) by Alyson Footer (Houston writer) for MLB as posted on the Astros website:

CF Michael Bourn

2B Kazuo Matsui

SS Miguel Tejada

1B Lance Berkman

LF Carlos Lee

RF Hunter Pence

3B Ty Wigginton

C J.R. Towles

SP Roy Oswalt

Certainly Wigginton, Towles and P is better than Everett, Ausmus and P Dan............ Thanks Perry and you are certainly correct. [/QUOTE]I don't agree...I think Lee hits 3rd and Tejada bats fifth. Lee is better than Tejada at this point of his career. He should get more at bats.

headhunters · Post by **headhunters** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 8:12 am

well- now that you gentlemen have spoken on the astros and dodgers lineups- you can start working on the white sox ( like your masters thesis). i pretty much suck at fantasy- but real baseball i am better at. i can tell you 3 things about the white sox- being a lifelong fan 1) kenny williams "plan" is to just keep trading. he is my hero- because he did what no one did for 100 years- win. but he has no plan other than to keep trading 2) if mr. hook posts any "source" from mlb or a writer- forget it- no one in chicago knows what kenny is up to- because kenny doesn't know. 3) getting swisher means more trades are on the way.

KJ Duke · Post by **KJ Duke** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 8:20 am

Originally posted by CC's Desperados:

quote:Originally posted by DOUGHBOYS:

quote:Originally posted by Captain Hook:

Projected Astros starting lineup (obviously as of now) by Alyson Footer (Houston writer) for MLB as posted on the Astros website:

CF Michael Bourn

2B Kazuo Matsui

SS Miguel Tejada

1B Lance Berkman

LF Carlos Lee

RF Hunter Pence

3B Ty Wigginton

C J.R. Towles

SP Roy Oswalt

Certainly Wigginton, Towles and P is better than Everett, Ausmus and P Dan............ Thanks Perry and you are certainly correct. [/QUOTE]I don't agree...I think Lee hits 3rd and Tejada bats fifth. Lee is better than Tejada at this point of his career. He should get more at bats. [/QUOTE]I have the same as Shawn for Lee/Tejada. I also see Pence hitting second, with Kaz @ 7 or 8.

CC's Desperados · Post by **CC's Desperados** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 8:32 am

Originally posted by KJ Duke:

quote:Originally posted by CC's Desperados:

quote:Originally posted by DOUGHBOYS:

quote:Originally posted by Captain Hook:

Projected Astros starting lineup (obviously as of now) by Alyson Footer (Houston writer) for MLB as posted on the Astros website:

CF Michael Bourn

2B Kazuo Matsui

SS Miguel Tejada

1B Lance Berkman

LF Carlos Lee

RF Hunter Pence

3B Ty Wigginton

C J.R. Towles

SP Roy Oswalt

Certainly Wigginton, Towles and P is better than Everett, Ausmus and P Dan............ Thanks Perry and you are certainly correct. [/QUOTE]I don't agree...I think Lee hits 3rd and Tejada bats fifth. Lee is better than Tejada at this point of his career. He should get more at bats. [/QUOTE]I have the same as Shawn for Lee/Tejada. I also see Pence hitting second, with Kaz @ 7 or 8. [/QUOTE]I agree with you Pence.

DOUGHBOYS · Post by **DOUGHBOYS** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 8:48 am

Starting out the year it will be Bourn, Matsui. When Bourn underperforms or Matsui gets hurt, Pence will be hitting 2nd.

Captain Hook · Post by **Captain Hook** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 8:52 am

Originally posted by DOUGHBOYS:

Starting out the year it will be Bourn, Matsui. When Bourn underperforms or Matsui gets hurt, Pence will be hitting 2nd. WINNER - WINNER - CHICKEN DINNER

Sheep · Post by **Sheep** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 1:45 pm

Originally posted by CC's Desperados:

quote:Originally posted by KJ Duke:

quote:Originally posted by CC's Desperados:

quote:Originally posted by DOUGHBOYS:

quote:Originally posted by Captain Hook:

Projected Astros starting lineup (obviously as of now) by Alyson Footer (Houston writer) for MLB as posted on the Astros website:

CF Michael Bourn

2B Kazuo Matsui

SS Miguel Tejada

1B Lance Berkman

LF Carlos Lee

RF Hunter Pence

3B Ty Wigginton

C J.R. Towles

SP Roy Oswalt

Certainly Wigginton, Towles and P is better than Everett, Ausmus and P Dan............ Thanks Perry and you are certainly correct. [/QUOTE]I don't agree...I think Lee hits 3rd and Tejada bats fifth. Lee is better than Tejada at this point of his career. He should get more at bats. [/QUOTE]I have the same as Shawn for Lee/Tejada. I also see Pence hitting second, with Kaz @ 7 or 8. [/QUOTE]I agree with you Pence. [/QUOTE]Guess I better look again

as I have:

1) Kaz 100 games Bourne 40 Pence 10 Abercrombie 10

2) Pence 120 Kaz 20 Loretta 20

3) Berkman 140 Pence 20

4) C.Lee 150 Berkman 10

5) Tejada 140 Cruz 10 Ty 10

6) Wigginton 120 Loretta 20 Towles 20

7) Towles 80 Ausmus 25 Bourne 10 Loretta 20 Erstad 20

8) Bourne 100 Ausmus 25 Quintero 10 Loretta 10 Blum 10

Balance) Abercrombie 20 Cruz 20 Blum 10

[ January 03, 2008, 07:55 PM: Message edited by: Sheep ]

CC's Desperados · Post by **CC's Desperados** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 3:06 pm

Originally posted by Sheep:

quote:Originally posted by CC's Desperados:

quote:Originally posted by KJ Duke:

quote:Originally posted by CC's Desperados:

quote:Originally posted by DOUGHBOYS:

quote:Originally posted by Captain Hook:

Projected Astros starting lineup (obviously as of now) by Alyson Footer (Houston writer) for MLB as posted on the Astros website:

CF Michael Bourn

2B Kazuo Matsui

SS Miguel Tejada

1B Lance Berkman

LF Carlos Lee

RF Hunter Pence

3B Ty Wigginton

C J.R. Towles

SP Roy Oswalt

Certainly Wigginton, Towles and P is better than Everett, Ausmus and P Dan............ Thanks Perry and you are certainly correct. [/QUOTE]I don't agree...I think Lee hits 3rd and Tejada bats fifth. Lee is better than Tejada at this point of his career. He should get more at bats. [/QUOTE]I have the same as Shawn for Lee/Tejada. I also see Pence hitting second, with Kaz @ 7 or 8. [/QUOTE]I agree with you Pence. [/QUOTE]Guess I better look again

as I have:

1) Kaz 100 games Bourne 40 Pence 10 Abercrombie 10

2) Pence 120 Kaz 20 Loretta 20

3) Berkman 140 Pence 20

4) C.Lee 150 Berkman 10

5) Tejada 140 Cruz 10 Ty 10

6) Wigginton 120 Loretta 20 Towles 20

7) Towles 80 Ausmus 25 Bourne 10 Loretta 20 Erstad 20

8) Bourne 100 Ausmus 25 Quintero 10 Loretta 10 Blum 10

Balance) Abercrombie 20 Cruz 20 Blum 10 [/QUOTE]Don't you wish this games was that easy!!

Vander · Post by **Vander** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 3:59 pm

Originally posted by headhunters:

well- now that you gentlemen have spoken on the astros and dodgers lineups- you can start working on the white sox ( like your masters thesis). i pretty much suck at fantasy- but real baseball i am better at. i can tell you 3 things about the white sox- being a lifelong fan 1) kenny williams "plan" is to just keep trading. he is my hero- because he did what no one did for 100 years- win. but he has no plan other than to keep trading 2) if mr. hook posts any "source" from mlb or a writer- forget it- no one in chicago knows what kenny is up to- because kenny doesn't know. 3) getting swisher means more trades are on the way. I give Williams great credit for building that team and I once thought he was one of the best gm's around. Some time last off season he took leave of his senses and it seems to be getting worse. I thought Gio was the best prospect in the Sox system which he gives away for a guy that doesn't seem to fit. He insists the Sox are the team to beat in the central (not sure how he figures that). They have 2 3b 2 SS no 2b 2/5th's of a starting staff and a very uncertain OF. Maybe Owens and Danks can come through, but to ask all the if's and maybe's to all play up to championship caliber is worse the overly optimistic. He's lost his mind.

DOUGHBOYS · Post by **DOUGHBOYS** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 6:45 pm

Guess I better look again

as I have:

1) Kaz 100 games Bourne 40 Pence 10 Abercrombie 10

2) Pence 120 Kaz 20 Loretta 20

3) Berkman 140 Pence 20

4) C.Lee 150 Berkman 10

5) Tejada 140 Cruz 10 Ty 10

6) Wigginton 120 Loretta 20 Towles 20

7) Towles 80 Ausmus 25 Bourne 10 Loretta 20 Erstad 20

8) Bourne 100 Ausmus 25 Quintero 10 Loretta 10 Blum 10

Balance) Abercrombie 20 Cruz 20 Blum 10

I am betting that not even Wayne overanalyzed this much!

Or if so, certainly not all the numbers would end with 0

Bobby J · Post by **Bobby J** » Fri Jan 04, 2008 10:24 am

[ January 04, 2008, 04:26 PM: Message edited by: Bobby J ]

Quahogs · Post by **Quahogs** » Fri Jan 04, 2008 10:31 am

Originally posted by DOUGHBOYS:

Guess I better look again

as I have:

1) Kaz 100 games Bourne 40 Pence 10 Abercrombie 10

2) Pence 120 Kaz 20 Loretta 20

3) Berkman 140 Pence 20

4) C.Lee 150 Berkman 10

5) Tejada 140 Cruz 10 Ty 10

6) Wigginton 120 Loretta 20 Towles 20

7) Towles 80 Ausmus 25 Bourne 10 Loretta 20 Erstad 20

8) Bourne 100 Ausmus 25 Quintero 10 Loretta 10 Blum 10

Balance) Abercrombie 20 Cruz 20 Blum 10

I am betting that not even Wayne overanalyzed this much!

Or if so, certainly not all the numbers would end with 0

It's like fantasy sudoku ! Every line up and down ends in 160 !

CC's Desperados · Post by **CC's Desperados** » Fri Jan 04, 2008 12:11 pm

Originally posted by Quahogs:

quote:Originally posted by DOUGHBOYS:

Guess I better look again

as I have:

1) Kaz 100 games Bourne 40 Pence 10 Abercrombie 10

2) Pence 120 Kaz 20 Loretta 20

3) Berkman 140 Pence 20

4) C.Lee 150 Berkman 10

5) Tejada 140 Cruz 10 Ty 10

6) Wigginton 120 Loretta 20 Towles 20

7) Towles 80 Ausmus 25 Bourne 10 Loretta 20 Erstad 20

8) Bourne 100 Ausmus 25 Quintero 10 Loretta 10 Blum 10

Balance) Abercrombie 20 Cruz 20 Blum 10

I am betting that not even Wayne overanalyzed this much!

Or if so, certainly not all the numbers would end with 0

It's like fantasy sudoku ! Every line up and down ends in 160 ! [/QUOTE]I think he is using a 1% margin for error.