Braun Suspended For Rest Of 2013 Season

[DOUGHBOYS]

AROD made an interesting quote the other day, in one of the few statement he has made on this PEDS issue. Asked if the Yankees had informed him of the Friday meeting, Rodriguez said, “I don’t think they have any involvement. I think that that’s strictly Major League Baseball. There’s a lot of players involved.”

If this is a direct quote, I find it very interesting.
Not from a steroid or ped point of view, but that of the psyche or ego that is Alex Rodriguez.
In playing baseball his whole life, he has strived to set himself apart from other players. To be the best. To be on top. To make the most money. And to be especially apart from all players in statistics .
Now, in being linked in this mess, he finds comfort in the company of other payers. To be one of the group.
To be one of many that offended.
Just a regular guy who as a kid would say, "I did it, but so did Bobby, Billy and Johnny!"

[Outlaw]

AROD made an interesting quote the other day, in one of the few statement he has made on this PEDS issue. Asked if the Yankees had informed him of the Friday meeting, Rodriguez said, “I don’t think they have any involvement. I think that that’s strictly Major League Baseball. There’s a lot of players involved.”

If this is a direct quote, I find it very interesting.
Not from a steroid or ped point of view, but that of the psyche or ego that is Alex Rodriguez.
In playing baseball his whole life, he has strived to set himself apart from other players. To be the best. To be on top. To make the most money. And to be especially apart from all players in statistics .
Now, in being linked in this mess, he finds comfort in the company of other payers. To be one of the group.
To be one of many that offended.
Just a regular guy who as a kid would say, "I did it, but so did Bobby, Billy and Johnny!"

Direct Quote as reported in various media outlets. I thought the same things you did Dough...

It appears that indefinate and or lifetime bans for some of the players is also more than just a pipe dream.

[Outlaw]

I've heard from people I know that AROD has indeed cooperated somewhat in that he did not continue the lies. Next will be telling all and like all the other cheating players, they deserve to be held accountable. Hard to see anyone attempting an appeal, especially if losing the appeal will be a permanent ban. Arod was also AWOL from last nights game according to Cashman, even though it was rained out. I Believe Bruan will be given one more chance to cooperate and if he does not, he will face banishment from the game as there will be no players anywhere covering for him and in fact some have already given MLB enough on Bruan already.
Interesting the info in the article below talking about all the different drugs that were being used. I also think that the players involved will be looking for some protection from MLB, if its even legally possible, from the FEDS. Unfortunatley, I dont think this just ends with MLB, the other pro sports are squarely in the eye of the storm, becuase this issue of PEDS use and distribution was just not about baseball. Hoping for all us fans that this all behind everyone for next season and even for this post season in terms of baseball.

Cruz also appears to want to ge this over with.

MLB may cut deal with Yankees' Alex Rodriguez to reduce his looming drug suspension:

According to the sources, a 150-game suspension might be the best that could be expected for Rodriguez, who is rehabbing from hip surgery with high Single-A Tampa and was chastised by the Yankees Saturday for failing to report to the team’s complex for Friday night’s game following a four-and-a-half hour meeting with MLB officials who outlined their case against him.

By Bill Madden AND Teri Thompson / NEW YORK DAILY NEWS
Saturday, July 13, 2013, 10:15 PM
.
Next up: Possible plea agreements.

Lawyers for Alex Rodriguez, now aware of the extent of Major League Baseball’s case against the Yankee third baseman and in a possible attempt to cut their client’s potentially massive losses, are engaging in internal discussions about brokering a plea deal with MLB to reduce A-Rod’s looming drug suspension, three sources familiar with baseball’s investigation into Anthony Bosch and the Biogenesis performance-enhancing drug scandal have told the Daily News.

According to the sources, a 150-game suspension might be the best that could be expected for Rodriguez, who is rehabbing from hip surgery with high Single-A Tampa and was chastised by the Yankees Saturday for failing to report to the team’s complex for Friday night’s game following a four-and-a-half hour meeting with MLB officials who outlined their case against him. His 20-day rehab assignment ends on July 22, and it is unclear where A-Rod will go after that, but according to a source, Yankee officials sent him a notification Saturday telling him that he is obligated to inform them in advance of any absence. Rodriguez also declined to accept an assignment to Buffalo, where the Yankees wanted him to join their Triple-A team, the Scranton/Wilkes-Barre Yankees, saying he was having a problem with his quad muscle. Rodriguez played in Saturday night’s game in Tampa, however.

According to another source, Rodriguez’s meeting with MLB ended at about 4 p.m., and a clearly shaken Rodriguez then met with MLB Players Association reps for an hour and a half to discuss what had been outlined by MLB officials. When Rodriguez didn’t show up at the Yankee complex, GM Brian Cashman then tried to reach the three-time AL MVP, who told him that he “just couldn’t make it.”

Meanwhile, an A-Rod spokesman told The News Saturday night in reference to a possible plea deal that “nobody from Alex’s team has made any such comments, and as we have said before, we are respecting the process and following the procedures as outlined in the joint agreement."

“I can see a scenario where if they’ve got multiple offenses (against A-Rod) that rather than going for his career with an arbitrator, baseball might settle on something like 150 games,” said one of the sources.

Among the drugs Rodriguez may have acquired, according to published accounts of Bosch’s records, are testosterone cream; IGF-1, a banned substance in baseball that stimulates insulin production and muscle growth; “troches,” a type of drug lozenge that includes 15% testosterone; pink cream, which Bosch wrote is a complex formula that also includes testosterone and growth hormone; and “Sub-Q,” referred to a mixture of HGH, IGF-1 and other drugs. Bosch is sure to have been discussing those records with MLB.

MLB has met with Rodriguez and several other players linked to Bosch and Biogenesis who are also expected to be suspended, including Milwaukee Brewers slugger Ryan Braun, whose name appeared next to “moneys owed” in notes a Bosch associate turned over to the Miami New Times last year. Braun’s then-lawyer, David Cornwell, who now represents Rodriguez, has said Braun’s legal team enlisted Bosch as an expert witness during the former NL MVP’s successful appeal of a 50-game drug suspension in late 2011. Braun has steadfastly denied getting performance-enhancing drugs from Bosch.

According to one of the baseball sources, MLB is believed to have brought up the possibility of a settlement in its meeting with Braun, who might also consider a deal, as would other players involved.

“That might be a victory for both sides,” said one of the sources, referring to the fact that a plea agreement would preempt the arbitration process and might salvage money and save face for everyone involved in what has become a highly contentious process.

In his interview Friday, Rodriguez is believed to have followed the strategy of 10 other major leaguers who were also interviewed by MLB, which was to invoke baseball’s version of the Fifth Amendment: remaining silent. But regardless of his level of cooperation, Rodriguez has now heard some of MLB’s case against him and will have to decide how best to protect what’s left of his reputation and the $100 million remaining on his contract with the Yankees.

Any suspension of Rodriguez, who will turn 38 later this month, for more than 100 to 150 games would likely end his career, since it would sideline him for almost two years, including the time he has missed since he was benched last October in the AL Championship Series against the Detroit Tigers. He then had hip surgery in January and has been recovering since then.

If Rodriguez is suspended while on the disabled list, he will not be paid for the duration of the suspension. However, if after that he is deemed physically unable to perform by doctors, the remainder of his contract would have to be paid by the Yankees.

“The bottom line is (MLB) wants these guys out of the game,” said one of the baseball sources. “In (A-Rod’s) case, 150 games would sufficiently accomplish that.”

[knuckleheads]

It appears that indefinate and or lifetime bans for some of the players is also more than just a pipe dream.

Outlaw, you are completely delusional if you think any player who has not previously been suspended will receive anything more than a 50-game suspension as a result of this BioGenesis ordeal. Also, a 50-game suspension is unlikely to stick for any player who has not given a positive drug sample. Rumors and accusations will not get it done.

Here is the Joint Drug Agreement: http://mlb.mlb.com/pa/pdf/jda.pdf

There is nothing in the above linked document that allows for a suspension without a positive test result. There is nothing in the JDA that allows the commissioner to grant immunity to some players for cooperating and harsher penalties to others for not cooperating.

Bud Selig is a PR buffoon. Remember the time he allowed the All-Star game to end in a tie because the NL ran out of pitchers, despite having 10 on the roster? MLB got heat for ending the game, so Selig, in an effort to prove just how much the game wouldn't be allowed to end in a tie again, linked home field advantage in the World Series to an exhibition game.

Now, after years of bungling the PED issue, (Re: Ryan Braun's tainted sample: Do you know how easy it is to following drug-testing protocols? You simple take the sample and ship it immediately upon completion of the test.That's all.) Selig is overreaching in his authority, using dubious methods, and breaching the JDA (there's a very clear section in JDA about Player Confidentiality...It's printed two sections before the disciplinary section).

Even if a few or several suspensions are doled out, MLB will end up with egg on its face once again at the conclusion of this episode.

[Outlaw]

It appears that indefinate and or lifetime bans for some of the players is also more than just a pipe dream.

Outlaw, you are completely delusional if you think any player who has not previously been suspended will receive anything more than a 50-game suspension as a result of this BioGenesis ordeal. Also, a 50-game suspension is unlikely to stick for any player who has not given a positive drug sample. Rumors and accusations will not get it done.

Here is the Joint Drug Agreement: http://mlb.mlb.com/pa/pdf/jda.pdf

There is nothing in the above linked document that allows for a suspension without a positive test result. There is nothing in the JDA that allows the commissioner to grant immunity to some players for cooperating and harsher penalties to others for not cooperating.

Bud Selig is a PR buffoon. Remember the time he allowed the All-Star game to end in a tie because the NL ran out of pitchers, despite having 10 on the roster? MLB got heat for ending the game, so Selig, in an effort to prove just how much the game wouldn't be allowed to end in a tie again, linked home field advantage in the World Series to an exhibition game.

Now, after years of bungling the PED issue, (Re: Ryan Braun's tainted sample: Do you know how easy it is to following drug-testing protocols? You simple take the sample and ship it immediately upon completion of the test.That's all.) Selig is overreaching in his authority, using dubious methods, and breaching the JDA (there's a very clear section in JDA about Player Confidentiality...It's printed two sections before the disciplinary section).

Even if a few or several suspensions are doled out, MLB will end up with egg on its face once again at the conclusion of this episode.

Knucklehead - I appreciate your point of view and opinion. I might be wrong in some or all of this, but I'm not delusional. I suggest you get all the JDA and CBA amendments. Ever hear of Non - analytical positive. PED users in this sort of case are subject to the "non-analytical positive." This segment of baseball's current anti-PED (JDA and CBA) program allows for suspensions to be levied against players who have not tested positive but who have been found to have purchased banned PEDs. Two Major League players were already suspended on this basis for purchasing HGH and steroids. One was Jordan Schaefer of the Braves, cant remember the other one.

I'm not that naive, and I doubt many people are, too believe that the use of PEDS is not a problem. It's been a big problem in MLB and it has gotten bigger the past 4 years because of the advancements in the drugs themselves and the masking agents. When I see, hear and read, where lots of "fans" support the players and say they deserve Union protection from the "knuckleheads" who run MLB, and they should fight and defend themselves, it defies logic. There is more than enough known that almost all of what has been reported is most likely true. 4 players already have been suspended that got their PEDS from Biogen and the other clinics. Its not that hard to see that there could be 20-100 more involved based on what has been reported.

At the end of the day, I could care less how many there are, how long they get suspended, when they get suspended or if they appeal, as long as, if any player did anything wrong or cheated, against the current rules, that they are held accountable and some form of discipline handed out. Then everyone can move on from this and take steps (MLB and the players) together to keep cleaning it up.

There is nothing wrong in believing The majority of current players (who are the Union) want the same things we all do, a Clean honest game, where hard work, talent, performance and records again mean something.

[knuckleheads]

I could not find any applicable amendments, but if you link them, I'd like to read them.

I would be supportive of 50-game suspensions, but to suggest players could be suspended the first time for more than 50 games for using PEDS on more than one occasion in the past, or using different PEDs frustrates the intent of a progressive disciplinary program.

[Bama]

Manny Ramirez was suspened without a positive test. He was suspended for receiving drugs from Bosch clinic so they dont have to have positive test to suspend, and from everything i have read or heard Outlaw is right on it so the rest of you naysayers better just accept that some of this is going to come to past soon.

[Outlaw]

I could not find any applicable amendments, but if you link them, I'd like to read them.

I would be supportive of 50-game suspensions, but to suggest players could be suspended the first time for more than 50 games for using PEDS on more than one occasion in the past, or using different PEDs frustrates the intent of a progressive disciplinary program.

As I have said, I have just offered my opinions on possible outcomes and discipline. I've also said I could care less really, how long, as long as they are held accountable and according to all agreements. The big stick is the powers the commissioner holds, all the bests interests of baseball stuff. Most of how and why suspensions can be handed out are in the JDA link you posted. The rest is in the CBA. The big picture is that it appears this will become the biggest scandal since the Black sox scandal. If you research MLB history you will see MLB was dealing with gambling for 40 years before they finally took drastic action. PEDS and drugs has been going full bore for 25 years now and I think Everyone is now finally tired of it and believe something needs to be done and this particular unseemly incident looks to be the impetus.

One thing a lot of people have not been talking about are the possible State and Federal crimes that have been possibly committed. This does not appear to some small illegal drug operation with only 1 clinic and a few people and players involved and trust me, the authorities are watching this closely. Any players involved should be more concerned with that aspect, then on whether they will be getting 25, 50, 100 game suspensions. Congress, the Feds, and others have been after these drug using players and cheats in all sports for years and this mess is being watched very closely. Even if MLB hands out their decisions and suspensions, from what I hear, the people involved better be prepared for the next stage, that has nothing to do with baseball. If anyone thinks MLB is not telling the players, thier lawyers and the union that, then, as someone here said to me a while back, I have a bridge in NY to sell you.

[Outlaw]

Manny Ramirez was suspened without a positive test. He was suspended for receiving drugs from Bosch clinic so they dont have to have positive test to suspend, and from everything i have read or heard Outlaw is right on it so the rest of you naysayers better just accept that some of this is going to come to past soon.

You are right, Manny did and the other name I forgot was, Jason Grimsley. BTW, The Feds are salivating on this mess too... whether they ever act remains to be seen I suppose on what MLB does and what MLB has.

NEW YORK -- Embattled pitcher Jason Grimsley was suspended 50 games by Major League Baseball on Monday, less than a week after federal agents raided his home during an investigation into performance-enhancing drugs.

Commissioner Bud Selig's office suspended Grimsley for violating baseball's Joint Drug Prevention and Treatment Program, based on his statements to authorities regarding human growth hormone.

"I think he earned it," Arizona Diamondbacks managing general partner Ken Kendrick said. "I think it sends a message and an appropriate message.

"He violated the agreement. Obviously MLB feels that he did. That's Bud's decision and I think it's the right decision and I applaud him for it," he said.

The Diamondbacks released the reliever last Wednesday -- they don't intend to pay him, either -- and his agent said he did not expect Grimsley to pitch again. If Grimsley returns, the penalty would take effect when he's placed on a 40-man roster.

"Nothing's changed," agent Joe Bick said Monday.

Last Tuesday, 13 agents searched Grimsley's Arizona home following his admission he had used HGH, steroids and amphetamines.

According to court documents, authorities tracked a package containing two "kits" of HGH -- about a season's worth -- that was delivered at Grimsley's house on April 19. He failed a baseball drug test in 2003, documents showed.

Acting on those documents, MLB suspended him for his alleged possession, admitted use and intended use of HGH. Baseball toughened its drug program and penalties this season, but there is no test for HGH.

"He's retired. It's a moot point," Detroit Tigers closer Todd Jones said. "He didn't test positive, but because he said he did, they're going to suspend him?

"It's kind of like giving a speeding ticket to a guy that got killed in a car wreck," he said.

The 38-year-old Grimsley was 1-2 with a 4.88 ERA in 19 games as a long reliever this season, his first with Arizona.

"The suspension will become effective only if Jason chooses to continue his playing career," said Michael Weiner, general counsel to the union. "The association will confer with Jason as to whether, under the circumstances, he wishes to grieve the suspension."

Grimsley and the Diamondbacks are currently in a dispute over payment of the remainder of his $825,000 salary.

Grimsley asked for his release last week and Arizona granted it. At the time, Bick said there had been no negotiation about money and added, "Released players get paid."

But the team later said it did not intend to pay him the rest and filed a notice of termination Monday.

"This guy did no less than steal from us," Kendrick said Saturday night.

Bick responded by saying Grimsley would contest the Diamondbacks' decision, and Weiner said the union would soon file a grievance.

"The Diamondbacks' release of Jason is a clear violation of the Basic Agreement," Weiner said.

[CASS]

I heard that Braun's sample was 'tampered' with because when they put it on Selig''s desk he though it was his Apple juice and tried to drink it.

[Outlaw]

I heard that Braun's sample was 'tampered' with because when they put it on Selig''s desk he though it was his Apple juice and tried to drink it.

I'm hearing its possible Bud may be spitting that sample back at Bruan and the dozens of other cheats as soon as this Wednesday and more than likley by July 22, but its definatley nearing a conclusion and I think people will be shocked at who, when, what and why.

[Bronx Yankees]

I heard that Braun's sample was 'tampered' with because when they put it on Selig''s desk he though it was his Apple juice and tried to drink it.

I'm hearing its possible Bud may be spitting that sample back at Bruan and the dozens of other cheats as soon as this Wednesday and more than likley by July 22, but its definatley nearing a conclusion and I think people will be shocked at who, when, what and why.

Thank goodness. I understand MLB taking its time, gathering evidence, and not rushing to act merely because stories have been leaked in the press. That being said, once the all-star game is over, MLB really needs to "shit or get off the can." This particular Biogenesis cloud has hung over this season for a LONG time. Also, the suspensions should be meted out before the trade deadline and, as a baseball fan, I'd love to "get it out of the way" well prior to the pennant races so that, come late-August and September, the only "magic numbers" we are talking about relate to wins/losses needed to clinch play-off spots and not dollars owed to some sleazy outfit in Florida.

Thanks for all the updates. This thread has become my "go to" source for the latest info (sprinkled with opinions, I know). Let's hope the next phase of the story is coming soon. It certainly will be interesting to watch for suspensions of guys not yet named. In terms of fantasy, my teams are pretty "clean" (to my knowledge), although I certainly may miss Everth Cabrera's stolen bases on some of them!

Mike

[Outlaw]

There is another scenario that could be playing out too, at least it is being considered based on info I have heard. A few times over past 3 months, I have talked about the Bests interests of baseball powers the commissioner has. Having looked into all the MLB rules, the Commissioner "articles" of authority, the JDP and the CBA I believe its possible MLB goes down this path in dealing with the possible Cheaters and Drug users. The basis for this is loosely based on the Pittsburgh Drug Scandal of 1986 and of course the Black Sox scandal. For some history on that see the below.

MLB, specifically went on the a little PR offensive the past few days. They released more information on their investigative team and efforts. The firms, attorneys, investigators and consultants they have hired are not Mickey and Minnie mouse types, they are the top of the field types of professionals. These are not the purported "goons" many have been portraying them as, especially segments of the media and people who think there is nothing to this story. In addition Selig did three interviews yesterday, and what he said, how he said it and what he didn't say, indicates where they may be going with this. He used the line "Best interests of baseball" at least 6 times in regards to questions about the PEDS story. MLB yesterday also had both All Star managers comment and make statements backing MLB's efforts. Some players also had more comments the past few days, bascially punish the cheaters.

Because of the way the JDP and the penalty language is written, specifically towards "analytical positives" the penalties mirror a positive test. In order for MLB to deal with this whole mess, and to be able to hand out different penalties, without all this "talk" about appeals, the commissioner may very well invoke His "best interests of baseball" powers. This would basically eliminate the appeals process by any player as it relates to the JDP and CBA. Sure, a suspended player could go to court, but good luck with that, lest they want to put themselves in legal and criminal jeopardy if they are involved in illegal PEDS distribution or illegally obtaining the drugs and across state lines also. Every player contract contains language that allows MLB to act in the best interests of the game. If the players involved really think the Union will back them and gather all the other clean players to support any effort to stop this, they are wrong. There is no support among the clean players for these players that may be involved. Even the "super" agent Scott Boras has backed off his ill timed and ill informed hard comments of last week, the past day or so.

There will be some who disagree with any and all of this mess, but I'll take the word of the Baseball people, from the Commissioner on down to the players, "espeically the clean players talking", that this is important and needs to be addressed and needs to be dealt with, as ugly as it may be for few days if and when it happens. After that, hopefully the game can move on. The news cycle these days, even on major stories has short life spans, as it always on to the next disturbing story. Baseball will be better off with the cheats gone and PEDS virtually eliminated and I like to believe that most fans want this now.


Pittsburgh Drug Scandal

The players were granted immunity in exchange for their testimony. Ex-Pirate John Milner talked about getting amphetamines from Hall of Famers Willie Mays and Willie Stargell. Milner added that he bought two grams of cocaine for $200 in the bathroom stalls at Three Rivers Stadium during a Pirates-Houston Astros game in 1980. Keith Hernandez revealed he'd used cocaine for three years. Hernandez added that about 40 percent of all Major League Baseball players were using cocaine at the time. Hernandez however, quickly backtracked by saying that he might have been "grossly wrong." Tim Raines told how he'd keep a gram of coke in his uniform pocket (as well as revealing that he snorted during games), and that he only slid into bases headfirst so as not to break the vial.

Testimony also revealed that Rod Scurry once went looking for cocaine during the late innings of a Pirates game. Drug dealers frequented the Pirates' clubhouse. Even the Pirate Parrot, Kevin Koch, was implicated for buying cocaine and introducing a few of the ballplayers to a local drug dealer.

Curtis Strong and six Pittsburgh men were convicted and found guilty of 11 counts of distributing cocaine by the United States District Court for the Western District of Pennsylvania.[1] Strong received a 12-year prison sentence but was ultimately released after serving just four years. Dale Shiffman from Pittsburgh was indicted on 111 counts, pled guilty to 20, was sentenced to twelve years and ultimately served two years.

On February 28, 1986, Baseball Commissioner Peter Ueberroth handed down suspensions to 11 players—seven for a full season. The players who were suspended for a full year were allowed to play under the condition that they donated 10 percent of their base salaries to drug-related community service, submitted to random drug testing, and contributed 100 hours of drug-related community service:

Joaquín Andújar
Dale Berra
Enos Cabell
Keith Hernandez
Jeffrey Leonard
Dave Parker
Lonnie Smith

In July 1987, Smith told the Kansas City Times that under his agreement with the Commissioner of baseball he was supposed to be tested six to eight times per-year but had not been tested to-date in 1987. More so, he strongly disagreed with Ueberroth that baseball was free from drugs.

The four players who were suspended for just 60 days were allowed to play if they donated 5 percent of base salaries and contributed 50 hours of drug-related community service:

Al Holland
Lee Lacy
Lary Sorensen
Claudell Washington
Peter Ueberroth also asked every player to submit to voluntary urine tests. Ultimately, the Players Association thwarted that plea.

Seven drug dealers pleaded guilty or were convicted of selling cocaine to players:

Shelby Greer, 49, of Mt. Washington: Pleaded guilty to seven criminal counts.
Dale Shiffman, 54, of Baldwin: Pleaded guilty to 20 criminal counts. Spent 24 months in the federal penitentiary.
Thomas P. Balzer: Pleaded guilty to selling cocaine. Sentenced to 18 months in prison.
Kevin M. Connolly: Pleaded guilty to selling cocaine. Sentenced to 2.5 years in prison.
Jeffrey L. Mosco, 49, of Shaler: Pleaded guilty to three drug-related counts. Spent 18 months in prison.
Robert W. "Rav" McCue: Convicted on seven counts of cocaine distribution.
Curtis Strong: Convicted on 11 counts of selling cocaine.

[CASS]

I don't think there will be an ounce of shock. MLB can't keep anything quiet - we know the list (20 players) - we know what suspensions they want, we know big names will appeal, we know the players union will laugh at the charges, and we know it will probably not be decided this season. MLB always ends up with egg on their face....why should this be any different. They'll get a few 50 game suspensions best case...after 6 months of court.

[Outlaw]

I don't think there will be an ounce of shock. MLB can't keep anything quiet - we know the list (20 players) - we know what suspensions they want, we know big names will appeal, we know the players union will laugh at the charges, and we know it will probably not be decided this season. MLB always ends up with egg on their face....why should this be any different. They'll get a few 50 game suspensions best case...after 6 months of court.

Only 20? The rumors/leaks only name about 12, not 20, what list are you seeing? Who are the others you know or suspect? No matter how it happens and how it gets sliced, going to legal court is not an option for any player, per the CBA. Arbitration is the only remedy at this point "if" there are any appeals. You assume the Union (which are the 95% of the clean players) will fight for the cheaters, the same cheaters the 95% want banned. The Union position and few words they have spoken are telling. All they and the alleged cheaters say, is due process.

[CASS]

I believe there were 8 or so minor leagues implicated...but i guess we'll see the final count soon. And as for the union - they have an OBLIGATION to fight for what was collectively bargained...PERIOD. That is their responsibility and I expect them to fullfill that.

[Money]

Outlaw, your reporting on this subject is second to none. I appreciate the time you take to keep us all informed with all of the information that's floating around out there. Wether any of us agree or disagree with you, you supply all of the facts.

My own interpretation is of a dual focus. The first is the impact on the Detroit Tigers. As of now it looks like Peralta and Peralta only. It will be a tough blow but survivable.

The second and most very important to all of us is the impact on the fantasy baseball season. It makes me sick to think that a lot of great teams/seasons are going to be ruined by all of this. Overall champions decided because of this, league champions decided because of all of this. It makes me want to puke.

If it comes as fast and as hard as you say we'll have to put asterisks by all of this seasons results. There will be no asterisks attached to the checks though.

[Hells Satans]

Michael Weiner just said that the appeals of any Biogenesis suspensions could take place "as soon as September", which makes it basically irrelevant for this season.

[Oaktown]

With appeals and legal stuff, will be a next year issue, not 2013.

[CASS]

Outlaw is going to be devestated! He all but guranteed the union could/wouldn't fight this and suspensions were coming and would stick! MLB will have egg on their face again....Union 100...MLB 0.

[Outlaw]

Outlaw is going to be devestated! He all but guranteed the union could/wouldn't fight this and suspensions were coming and would stick! MLB will have egg on their face again....Union 100...MLB 0.

LOL- that is funny... Devastated, heart broken, delusional... please do not worry about me, I just care about the game of baseball at every level and I hope the truth comes out, no matter what the outcome and that its the truth. It is amzing how many opine without researching a thing.

To quote "Michael Wiener" Today:

"Players involved in Biogenesis not bound by drug agreement and could get 5 game suspensions or even 500 games"

"50-game suspensions may not apply to non-analytical positives. Length of suspension open for discussion"

"If there are appeals on Biogenesis case, they could be heard as early as September" Big "IF" IMO

"says key is to try to make the upcoming suspensions fair. Says Player’s Association position is suspensions that should not be announced until an appeal is heard"

"It's been a struggle," Wiener said, referring to the developments surrounding the Biogenesis investigation and seeing the evidence

"Sometimes they've been forthcoming, sometimes we wish they'd be more forthcoming," Wiener said of MLB. "In terms of what they've learned, we have had to fight them every step of the way. It's been a struggle. Even if we get an agreement there will probably more struggle along the way."

"Wiener noted that players involved in Biogenesis do not necessarily have their disciplined tied to the joint drug agreement's guidelines" Airgo IMO "BEST INTERESTS of BASEBALL"

I'm pretty confident Wiener is doing the best he can to maintain the Union position, not knowing all the facts, records, evidence and witness testimony MLB has as he alludes to above. We will not hear any CLEAN player backing any of his opinions up. This is PR 101. Right now MLB is most likely involved in the negotiations he alludes to about agreements with each player involved and what the discipline will be. Unfortunately it appears the PA holds very few cards and MLB will act and they will act swiftly and harshly when they feel it is the right time, whether the PA agrees or not. Again, 95% of the payers want the cheaters gone and they want them gone yesterday.

One thing about all the people who want to see the players as victims and opine on the cheaters behalf, they seem to cherry pick the actual real news and facts. Same thing the press does with anything. Anyone that has followed this story knows full well it was never going to be just about the JDA and Wiener confirms that. This is about criminal illegal drug distribution and MLB appears to be close to having what they need in respect to its players being involved. Again, The FEDS and Congress are watching this and think what you want about those 2 entities, but I would not want be on the wrong side of them.

I will agree, it would stink if it went into the off season and then next season. Baseball and its fans would be dealing with players serving suspensions next season. Its more than just our fantasy season, as Cheating and Drugs are just plain wrong ....in any sport.

[Hells Satans]

The Feds aren't interested in this at all. If they were, MLB would not have been able to do this investigation, especially the way they have done it. MLB has destroyed any ability that the government would have to bring a criminal prosecution.

[Outlaw]

A few more true facts and statements... interpet them as you wish. I will say, so little said by any alleged player, and even the union admits through thier very little statements they got players who appear to have cheated. For anyone that thinks the alleged players are not worried about crimminal charges, that is one thing MLB is making sure they do know.


"When all the interviews are done, we will meet with the commissioner's office and we'll try to work something out," Weiner said. "Our players that deserve the suspensions, we'll try to cope with their suspensions. Our players that don't deserve suspensions, we will argue that they don't deserve a suspension. And I hope we have success. We may not have success on every single player, but I hope we have a fair amount of success."

"In theory, they could be suspended for five games or 500 games," Weiner said. "We could then choose to challenge or not, but the commissioner's office is not bound by the 50-100-life scale."

"They've got to prove all those cases. I like Dan Halem, a lot, but he's going to be running around like the proverbial chicken with its head cut off," Weiner said, referring to an MLB senior vice president. "If that's the circumstance, we'll just have to schedule them and get them done as quickly as we reasonably can. And if we have the number that you suggest, it's going to take a while."

"We're going to have a discussion with them. That discussion will include whether or not names of suspended players will be announced publicly," Weiner said Tuesday during a meeting with the Baseball Writers' Association of America.

"We've heard from a lot of players that increased penalties are called for. We've heard from a lot of other players that don't think increased penalties are called for," Weiner said. "And I imagine we will work it out at or near in early December and then have a negotiation with them over that very subject."

[Outlaw]

One day after Weiner tried to appear as if the Union would fight tooth and nail, he speaks again yesterday almost totally against what he said the previous day. I suspect some private discussions took place between him and MLB in the past 2 days. Usually when you get the PTB on both sides speaking about what ifs and on the record, they are trying to get out in front of the story that is about to break by posturing. If you read Wieners comments, they are almost the same things that have been discussed by me and others in this thread. Players are going to cut deals to avoid the appeals and I believe some players could get as little as 25 games, if they told/tell the truth. I've also heard MLB has info related to Bruans failed test in Oct 2011 that shows when He received the PEDS. Since MLB was onto Biogen way before then, its not a reach to suspect they knew about it and that's why they tested him, even though it was the off season for him.

I sure hope AROD does not put on then Yankee uniform again, his arrogance and now him saying he cant wait to get back is appalling. An admitted cheater, who immediately took advantage of Wieners comments the other day, he must be gagging on Wieners comments from yesterday. AROD just cannot keep his mouth shut. Knowing he denied PEDS use for years, then admitting it finally in 2009, its not a stretch to think everything he says is a lie and self serving. The Liars and the cheaters everywhere have all collapsed and proven to be frauds under the weight of thier own words and lies.

Lastly I hope Mike Weiner wins his battle with cancer. He's a good guy, fair and has done a lot to heal the PEDS and Drug wounds caused by previous Union leaders. He has the right stuff and the right attitude about life, family, MLB and career!

In a kid-gloved WFAN radio interview on Wednesday, Alex Rodriguez vowed to join his Yankee teammates in Texas next week, but the executive director of baseball’s union painted what is potentially an ominous picture for A-Rod’s future and that of the other major leaguers linked to the Biogenesis scandal.

Speaking to the Daily News at a union golf fund-raiser for Hurricane Sandy charities at Bethpage Black, Michael Weiner said that if Major League Baseball has overwhelming evidence linking the players to the defunct anti-aging clinic and its founder, Anthony Bosch, the powerful Players Association may be in the position of having to cry uncle.

Union head Michael Weiner told the New York Daily News that the MLBPA is "not interested" in protecting players for whom overwhelming evidence exists that they used performance-enhancing drugs.

“I can tell you, if we have a case where there really is overwhelming evidence, that a player committed a violation of the program, our fight is going to be that they make a deal,” Weiner said without referring to specific players. “We’re not interested in having players with overwhelming evidence that they violated the (drug) program out there. Most of the players aren’t interested in that. We’d like to have a clean program.”

Although Weiner was not specifically speaking about Rodriguez, sources have told The News that MLB investigators have gathered an overwhelming amount of evidence that shows the Yankee star received performance-enhancing drugs from Biogenesis. Players connected to Biogenesis will soon begin meeting with union officials and MLB executives to discuss pending penalties.

Players who don’t grieve suspensions are expected to begin serving them immediately; those who opt for arbitration could see their cases drag into next year.

“We will surely meet with the commissioner’s office and try to resolve all the pending cases. If we can’t, we’ll have arbitration cases. At this point, that’s all we can say. It will happen soon,” Weiner said. Speaking to baseball writers on Tuesday, Weiner said that the union will try to find common ground with MLB officials on the length of suspensions and how they will be publicized. He reiterated that on Wednesday, adding that in many instances grievances, including some involving banned substances, are settled before a suspension is imposed and publicly announced.

“This is a somewhat new situation, but some of those grievances have been disciplinary grievances as well,” Weiner said. “They just don’t get the play that the Biogenesis case did.”
A source said in the past Weiner has quietly convinced MLB to drop 10 to 15 drug cases (positive test results) by pointing out flaws in those cases. Weiner also raised questions about the highly contentious Ryan Braun arbitration of 2012. In that case, the Brewers star was supported by the Players Association and successfully challenged a 50-game doping suspension by raising questions about the chain of custody of his urine sample.

“The Braun case was one of many where there were problems with the case,” the source said. “The others just didn’t become public.”

Braun’s case became public after it was leaked to ESPN during the hearing process.

“He’s very modest,” the source said of Weiner. “His biggest victories were kept quiet.”

The News reported Sunday that according to three different sources familiar with the Biogenesis matter, A-Rod’s legal team was internally discussing a possible plea agreement. Rodriguez met with league representatives in Tampa on Friday and seemed shaken after they presented him with baseball’s case against him, according to one source.
Baseball’s drug policy calls for suspensions for positive drug tests, but commissioner Bud Selig can depart from those guidelines in the case of non-analytical positives — guilt based on evidence other than laboratory tests of urine or blood samples.

[Outlaw]

Now that it is out there in the press, and something I have been saying for months, another clinic with footprints in Miami and Atlanta, run by the same guy, a Dr. Clayton Gibson and his anti-aging program Clinics. He was "treating" some of the Track and field athletes that just got busted for using PEDs, such as Tyson Gay, who already has admitted he did. He also has "worked" with NFL and MLB players. There are other clinics in Texas and AZ on MLB's radar too. He also attended the same training center as Tony B did, American Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine. They promote the use of HGH and other "drugs" among some of their training programs. Dr. Gibson immediately lawyered up also this week. Seems Gay is implicating him. Biogenesis/Tony B also has "treated"/ "helped" other athletes in almost every major sport. MLB most assuredly will have an ethical, if not legal responsibility to notify others with the information they appear to uncovering in the Biogen investigation.