A Whining Post

[DOUGHBOYS]

Whining on the Message Boards is one of the worst sins. It ranks right up there with threats, name calling, and other acts that make us go
So, with that in mind, I am going to whine. Its a warning, so that you can quit reading here if need be...

I love the NFBC. There are very few drawbacks when one thinks of the NFBC. I've loved that we have/had characters like Walla Walla, Chest Rockwell, rockitsauce, Crazy Like a Fox, God Loves You, Sportsbettingman, Gekko, everybody...
I love that we have gone through the humble beginnings of Krause. And surviving the stupidness of Fanball. And found the safe waters of STATS.
I love that Greg and Tom have seemingly put the NFBC above some of their own personal items or agendas. They know how important they and the NFBC are to each one of us.
But we can never tell them enough, so thanks Greg and Tom.

On to the whine...
For years, literally years (I say that because everybody is using 'literally' like it's a new word), the NFBC has been featuring snake drafts and auctions. When starting out, the NFBC was a Main Event competition Live Event only. Technology got better though, and mock drafts were replaced by satelite drafts and then on a wider scale, slow drafts.
Now, for the most part, mock drafts are not a consideration for NFBC drafters.
The high cost of doing Main Events in the NFBC was now joined by smaller costs drafts to prepare for the higher end drafts.
Brilliant, really.

Unfortunately, the same cannot be said for auctions. Auctions are still the 'pay a lot of money or don't play at all' part of the NFBC.
I hate it.
It galls at me like no other thing about the NFBC.
There are hundreds of people that would enter an auction format at a lesser price and yet it is not offered.
It is always an item that is back burnered when it should be happening yesterday.

I know that money is behind not having a draft room for auctions. It's always about money. Until such a draft room for auctions could be built, isn't there some place that STATS could partner up with to allow us to draft in an auction format?
Perhaps even using a free site and then exporting players names to NFBC rosters.
Energies should be spent in opening up a new wave of drafters of auctions, rather than impulse buyers of new games.

In opening these auction rooms, it would lead to doubling, tripling, or even more of the Live Auction drafts offered.
The NFBC has always been on the cutting edge. A customer first based operation.
But, they have done nothing to further the auction side of fantasy baseball since started 11 years ago.
With so many other innovations and creations, it is a black eye and something that should be addressed, not back burnered.
Thank you for listening to a whiner.....

[Gekko]

Other than the money, a concern area for some would be if their internet connection went down or had a computer failure during the auction or the auction room froze for some as the bidding wound down to one or two seconds with owners repeatedly pushing a higher bid in the system . I can see some pissed off owners

[DOUGHBOYS]

Other than the money, a concern area for some would be if their internet connection went down or had a computer failure during the auction or the auction room froze for some as the bidding wound down to one or two seconds with owners repeatedly pushing a higher bid in the system . I can see some pissed off owners

That's a small problem. The same thing happens during snakes. Roll it back.
There are online sites that do these.
Even if only having an entry fee of a $100, the money would be recouped at Live Events. It's no secret that the same folks enter these higher priced auctions.
New folks don't want to invest four figures for 'an experience'. They want to be immediately competitive.
This is the only avenue that provides that.

[Gekko]

Back when the nfbc used an auction site, a couple owners just gave up partly due to the system freezing when there was one or two seconds remaining. Owners would keep pushing the bid +$1 button thinking their bid didn't go through. Owners were getting players for higher amounts than they thought. It was a disaster

[DOUGHBOYS]

Back when the nfbc used an auction site, a couple owners just gave up partly due to the system freezing when there was one or two seconds remaining. Owners would keep pushing the bid +$1 button thinking their bid didn't go through. Owners were getting players for higher amounts than they thought. It was a disaster

Technology is better now. Problems like that are fewer. I can't remember even having a problem with online drafts over the last year or two.
Your caution is heeded though.

[DOUGHBOYS]

FantasyAuction.net does these drafts for $88.
If STATS gave them a call, a partnership could be formed. I know I'm making this seem simplistic and that it isn't as easy as making a phone call, but right now we have bumkus. Not a trace of the willingness to even feature an auction for lesser money.
It is just a darned shame that so many folks would like to be a part of something like this, but it seems to have a perpetual 'wait till next year' connotation.

[ToddZ]

There are sites that have auction software. CBS and OnRoto to name a couple.

I run a NFBC-like high stakes NL only auction each spring on CBS.

There are reasons why the NFBC does not do down this road and coming from someone who wants these more than anyone, I understand their reticence completely.

I think sometimes we are naive or oblivious to some of the nuances -- read legality of running pay for play contests. The last thing the NFBC needs is a problem associated with an on-line draft, especially if it is a result of a third party.

Heck, there are people suing loopholes to sue the DFS sites that never played even one game.

ESPECIALLY in a contest that crowns an overall champ, I completely understand and respect the NFBC's stand.

All that said, I am holding out hope that the OnRoto room is viable. If anyone can get it done, they can.

[Money]

I agree with you Dan, an entry level auction would be a great place for some of us to start. I've always been kind of envious of those who excel at that format. I love the dollar values and exact reinforcement you get throughout the year from the ever changing values. At seasons conclusion you know you paid x for a guy and he was worth x plus or minus. As those of us that don't participate we run into these numbers all over the place in preparation for our drafts. We're kind of stuck with, I got a guy in the 6th round who delivered 4th round production. The auction player says I paid $17 and he delivered $24 in value. There is an exactness to it that I believe helps you in all other formats. I enjoy looking at the values and what players delivered according to the formulas.

From a business standpoint most players either cap their participation at $ spent or number of teams they can manage. Up until this season I've done both. I can't see myself actively managing more than 5 FAAB teams in a given year, that means something has to go if I decide to join an auction.

Even at the lowest level of participation I'm not sure we'd get max learning out of the experience. I think you've mentioned it before, the best way to learn would be to partner up with one of our many resident pros. Once the team is drafted any of us can apply our in season management approach. It's a level playing field at that point. Getting to that point is a different story.

Sorry for rambling, ultimately I agree that the NFBC should provide lower priced on line auctions. Good luck in your quest to convince them of that. I'm sure it's on their list, just not sure how high, especially now with the cutline coming into focus in 2015.

[Bronx Yankees]

I want to second Dan's "whine." Because I have commented previously on this topic, I will keep this response brief.

I have never played in an auction format and would like to do so. If the software was made available to do NFBC drafts in the auction format on-line, at low price levels (e.g., $150 like DC drafts), I certainly would do several and, if I liked the format, would be a prime candidate to join one or more of the NFBC's higher-priced auctions at some time down the road.

This is my third year with the NFBC. Probably like many others, I played fantasy baseball for years, but in local leagues and on some more widely-known but lower-priced (and less competitive) sites. I had never heard of the NFBC and can't remember exactly how I stumbled upon it. Doing my first $150 DC draft was a step up for me financially from my prior experiences with fantasy baseball. I wound up doing several leagues that first year and loved it. The next year I did even more of the lower-priced leagues. Now, fast forward a bit, after thoroughly enjoying my NFBC snake draft leagues, getting comfortable with the various formats, and at least having some modicum of success, I am "stepping up" this year and just signed up for my first Main Event team. I cannot wait to experience live drafting NFBC-style and competing against the best in the Main Event.

I think Dan is absolutely right when it comes to auctions. No matter their financial situation, most folks simply will not want to spend $1,300 and up on a format with which they are not familar or experienced. A gradual transition at different price points would be optimal. If on-line auction drafts were brought to the NFBC "masses," I am sure that many current auction draft participants would do multiple auction leagues on-line prior to the March live auctions. Additionally, auction "newbies" like myself would try the format and some or many of us eventually would "graduate" to the higher-priced live auction leagues.

While I realize this capability cannot be acquired overnight, I sure wish this also was on the NFBC "to do" list for 2015. Whine over.

Mike

[DOUGHBOYS]

There are sites that have auction software. CBS and OnRoto to name a couple.

I run a NFBC-like high stakes NL only auction each spring on CBS.

There are reasons why the NFBC does not do down this road and coming from someone who wants these more than anyone, I understand their reticence completely.

I think sometimes we are naive or oblivious to some of the nuances -- read legality of running pay for play contests. The last thing the NFBC needs is a problem associated with an on-line draft, especially if it is a result of a third party.

Heck, there are people suing loopholes to sue the DFS sites that never played even one game.

ESPECIALLY in a contest that crowns an overall champ, I completely understand and respect the NFBC's stand.

All that said, I am holding out hope that the OnRoto room is viable. If anyone can get it done, they can.

Money is the root of all Legal.

How about this....
We get together a league of 15 drafters. We all draft on a specific night using CBS or another site.
Once everybody is satisfied that it was a good draft and it is completed, the players are exported to NFBC and the season is played there.

[ToddZ]

There are sites that have auction software. CBS and OnRoto to name a couple.

I run a NFBC-like high stakes NL only auction each spring on CBS.

There are reasons why the NFBC does not do down this road and coming from someone who wants these more than anyone, I understand their reticence completely.

I think sometimes we are naive or oblivious to some of the nuances -- read legality of running pay for play contests. The last thing the NFBC needs is a problem associated with an on-line draft, especially if it is a result of a third party.

Heck, there are people suing loopholes to sue the DFS sites that never played even one game.

ESPECIALLY in a contest that crowns an overall champ, I completely understand and respect the NFBC's stand.

All that said, I am holding out hope that the OnRoto room is viable. If anyone can get it done, they can.

Money is the root of all Legal.

How about this....
We get together a league of 15 drafters. We all draft on a specific night using CBS or another site.
Once everybody is satisfied that it was a good draft and it is completed, the players are exported to NFBC and the season is played there.

Let me get in touch with OnRoto. I'm about to set up some regular mock drafts through my site and wanted to include some auction - plus I want to suggest my NL league give it a go.

There's also no reason we can't just play it out on OnRoto.

[DOUGHBOYS]

Sounds great, Todd.

[Gekko]

If it was a DC format, I would play multiple auctions. I don't have any interest in $150 FAAB auctions

[DOUGHBOYS]

If it was a DC format, I would play multiple auctions. I don't have any interest in $150 FAAB auctions

What would be the length of a 50 round auction?

[DOUGHBOYS]

OR...
What if we had a 30 round auction and ended it with a 20 round e-mail snake?

[Bronx Yankees]

That would sound good to me. Also trying to limit the number of FAAB leagues for myself. I think the usual auction is 23 rounds (i.e., the starting lineups) with a snake draft for the reserves. (Not positive if the NFBC does it like this.) We could do a 23 round auction and a 27 round snake draft and then input the teams into the DC format as Mark suggests. I suppose it could be 30 auction/20 snake or 25/25 instead of 23/27. My only request (in addition to being allowed to participate ) is that the snake draft portion be done at a more leisurely pace. I would think a 23-30 round auction will require a fair amount of time, and to then do a 20-27 round snake draft right on top of that would make for a very long "experience." I would think a committed group of drafters could handle the snake portion in a couple of days or certainly less than a week. If I am wrong about the auction taking a really long time (Todd?), I would be willing to try doing it all in one night, although that would not be my preference.

Mike

[ToddZ]

I would set aside 6 hours for a 15 team, 23 man auction.

Not saying we'd need it but I'm not sure if I'd take the over or under.

This factors in getting used to the software.

I STRONGLY RECOMMEND either doing a conference call along with the auction (there are numbers that you call into and get charged the long distance rate but everyone has cell minutes) OR asking everyone to be on Skype. Skype is fine except when you lose your complete connection. If all that happens is the room freezes, you can let everyone know.

[DOUGHBOYS]

I was thinking the remaining 20 or 27 rounds of snake would be done through slow drafting. Not that night.
I've also been told since my first post that ESPN's auction site has been almost flawless over the last couple of years.
Somehow, whether it is through Todd or some other means, we can make this happen.
There are just too many that want this to happen.
If the NFBC can agree to import the players, we would have the best of three worlds.
1. We would be participating in an auction at a Slow Draft price.
2. We would be participating in a snake slow draft.
3. It would be played under the NFBC umbrella.
There would be no need for this to have an 'Overall' Championship. It would simply be a learning experience for most. Garnering experience and depth in our game to possibly put down more money for a Live Event Auction.

[DOUGHBOYS]

Damn! This is why I love the NFBC!
Start a whiney post and results come out of it.
Greg thinks that the software will support transporting players from an auction site to the NFBC, and slow drafting the final 27 rounds here. Some fixes would have to be made to insure these were private leagues, not part of the overall.
The price points would be $125 and $250 to match satelite pricing.

When we hear more from Todd, assuming it is good news, we will start taking sign ups for these drafts.
We'll set up for Friday's or Saturday's.
The software will need some adjustment time, so we'll need to give Greg a three or four week heads up from Todd's ok.
This will mean that drafts will start around the beginning of February.
If Todd's site balks or delivers bad news, I have heard that ESPN has good site, but do not know when that opens.
Either way, affordable auction drafting, slow drafting, and playing under the NFBC umbrella looks to be a go.

[Gekko]

as mentioned, 23 man auction, slow draft the remaining players, no overall championship.

[ToddZ]

I'll send OnRoto a note.

I have an idea when the ESPN site will be ready. They'd work as well.

We'll get it done. I can also format the auction results in any manner necessary for easy import into the NFBC commish.

[DOUGHBOYS]

as mentioned, 23 man auction, slow draft the remaining players, no overall championship.

That is the thought.
Adding FAAB at this stage would lessen interest...

[KJ Duke]

Easy way to do this - setup both the auction site and a normal slow draft room to start at the same time. At auction's end everyone immediately drafts the players they acquired in auctin thru 23 rounds (which probably takes ~45 minutes); then the slow draft continues on NFBC. No importing or special setup required by STATS.

[DOUGHBOYS]

I don't know how draft position is set up for auctions on these sites or the time frames. But if it works within what we could do with the NFBC, that is a great thought.

[Rog]

And that is why you make the big bucks. Great idea to this entire situation