Greg,
I was studying hard the prize distributions and maybe it is just me, but it seems like there is way too much difference between 1 and 2nd place and not enough betwen 2nd and 3rd.
I did a little excel analysis and it shows that you make the 2nd place prize anywhere from 35.% of the top prize (in the #250 league) to 41%. However you make the 3rd place prize anywhere from 50% to 80.7% (in the 12 team AL only league) of the 2nd place prize.
Is finishing 1st really worth >2x the payout of 2nd? Shouldn't there be a like a 2nd is 50% of 1st, and 3rd is 50% of 2nd type of distribution? isn't that fairer? Not to mention that the top place in the Main event teams is competiting often for more prize money on top?
Yes, I have a vested interest in this (i finished 2nd in the $650 mized) but even before the end, I was looking at payouts and thinking that $4000 / $2000 would have been a little more fair.... If you want to keep the top high (I know it creates more marketing buzz), then take a bit off the 3rd place teams...
What does everyone else think?
Auction Leagues Prize Structure ($1,250 Entry Fee)
12-Team AL-Only Leagues:
1st Place: 7000 36%
2nd Place: 2500 70%
3rd Place: 1750
13-Team NL-Only Leagues:
1st Place: 7500 37%
2nd Place: 2750 69%
3rd Place: 1900
15-Team Mixed Leagues:
1st Place: 8500 40%
2nd Place: 3400 62%
3rd Place: 2100
Auction Leagues Prize Structure ($650 Entry Fee)
12-Team AL-Only Leagues:
1st Place: 3500 37%
2nd Place: 1300 81%
3rd Place: 1050
13-Team NL-Only Leagues:
1st Place: 3800 37%
2nd Place: 1400 79%
3rd Place: 1100
15-Team Mixed Leagues:
1st Place: 4250 41%
2nd Place: 1750 74%
3rd Place: 1300
NFBC Ultimate Leagues
Ultimate Draft & Auction Leagues:
1st Place: 40000 38%
2nd Place: 15000 50%
3rd Place: 7500
NFBC Satellite Leagues
$1,000 Entry Fee Satellite Leagues:
1st Place: 8000 38%
2nd Place: 3000 50%
3rd Place: 1500
$500 Satellite Leagues:
1st Place: 4000 38%
2nd Place: 1500 50%
3rd Place: 750
$250 Satellite Leagues:
1st Place: 2000 35%
2nd Place: 700 54%
3rd Place: 375
$100 Satellite Leagues:
1st Place: Winner take all for a 2007 NFBC free entry
$100 Satellite Leagues (2nd option if you're interested):
1st Place: 800 38%
2nd Place: 300 50%
3rd Place: 150
Thoughts in prize distributions
Thoughts in prize distributions
Ahhhh, huh, breaking up prizes into percentages seems futile and pointless. Nevertheless the prize structure for the main event seems worth discussing especially since new monies from an expanding contest would (hopefully) go back into the pool.
3rd place in each league seems somewhere just north of nothing. Not that it is nothing but you're not even getting back what you put in.
Conversation A:
"I won $750 in fantasy baseball!"
"Wow! How much did it cost to enter?"
"Only $1250."
"I know the name of a good money manager if you're looking."
Situation A:
You scratch off a dollar scratcher. You win 50 cents. It just doesn't happen.
At least if you get your money back you get some satisfaction.
1st and 2nd are fine.
Another thing and I know people have argued against this before, but more money in the overall would be a good thing. Of course it's a draw and it should be. Winning your league only covers the price of that year and three failures. Unless you're building a portfolio like Childs, you're goal has to be that you might make a surge to take the championship. For most people it wouldn't be worth it to play for just the $5000 every year, so why not raise the draw of the thing we're really playing for, especially as more and more people are playing for it.
I hope the plan is to eventually split the contest. 600 people vying for $100,000 seems markedly less appealing.
3rd place in each league seems somewhere just north of nothing. Not that it is nothing but you're not even getting back what you put in.
Conversation A:
"I won $750 in fantasy baseball!"
"Wow! How much did it cost to enter?"
"Only $1250."
"I know the name of a good money manager if you're looking."
Situation A:
You scratch off a dollar scratcher. You win 50 cents. It just doesn't happen.
At least if you get your money back you get some satisfaction.
1st and 2nd are fine.
Another thing and I know people have argued against this before, but more money in the overall would be a good thing. Of course it's a draw and it should be. Winning your league only covers the price of that year and three failures. Unless you're building a portfolio like Childs, you're goal has to be that you might make a surge to take the championship. For most people it wouldn't be worth it to play for just the $5000 every year, so why not raise the draw of the thing we're really playing for, especially as more and more people are playing for it.
I hope the plan is to eventually split the contest. 600 people vying for $100,000 seems markedly less appealing.
Chance favors the prepared mind.
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Chest Rockwell
- Posts: 2400
- Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 6:00 pm
- Contact:
Thoughts in prize distributions
Greg-
I do not have a suggestion how to do it, but I think it would be a very good thing to get the 3rd place team to at least the entry fee. I know there are only so many dollars to go around, will not be easy.
I do not have a suggestion how to do it, but I think it would be a very good thing to get the 3rd place team to at least the entry fee. I know there are only so many dollars to go around, will not be easy.
-
Greg Ambrosius
- Posts: 41076
- Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2004 6:00 pm
- Contact:
Thoughts in prize distributions
Originally posted by Chest Rockwell:
Greg-
I do not have a suggestion how to do it, but I think it would be a very good thing to get the 3rd place team to at least the entry fee. I know there are only so many dollars to go around, will not be easy. Well, I guess everyone will have their thoughts on this, but if we grow beyond 330 teams we have several ways to spread that extra money in the main event. If we add $500 per third place league finish, it would take an extra $12,000 if we reach 24 leagues. So if we hit 360 teams, we could increase third place to $1,250.
Others would argue -- and I am one of them -- that the extra money should go towards the overall prize pool, since we've expanded from 300 teams to 360. I am increasing second through 10th overall by $11,000+ in 2007 (remember, each new league already has $8,000 in league prizes allocated) because I felt there was too big of a gap between first place and the other top finishers. After 360, I'd love to increase first place overall beyond $100,000.
Others would like to see second place moved to $2,500 to double your money. Others would like to see first place moved to $6,000. As we continue to grow beyond 360 teams, we'll have some options, but I think many people would like to see the top prizes increased rather than third place league money. It's the goal of everyone to WIN.
Just my two cents, for what they're worth.
Greg-
I do not have a suggestion how to do it, but I think it would be a very good thing to get the 3rd place team to at least the entry fee. I know there are only so many dollars to go around, will not be easy. Well, I guess everyone will have their thoughts on this, but if we grow beyond 330 teams we have several ways to spread that extra money in the main event. If we add $500 per third place league finish, it would take an extra $12,000 if we reach 24 leagues. So if we hit 360 teams, we could increase third place to $1,250.
Others would argue -- and I am one of them -- that the extra money should go towards the overall prize pool, since we've expanded from 300 teams to 360. I am increasing second through 10th overall by $11,000+ in 2007 (remember, each new league already has $8,000 in league prizes allocated) because I felt there was too big of a gap between first place and the other top finishers. After 360, I'd love to increase first place overall beyond $100,000.
Others would like to see second place moved to $2,500 to double your money. Others would like to see first place moved to $6,000. As we continue to grow beyond 360 teams, we'll have some options, but I think many people would like to see the top prizes increased rather than third place league money. It's the goal of everyone to WIN.
Just my two cents, for what they're worth.
Greg Ambrosius
Founder, National Fantasy Baseball Championship
General Manager, Consumer Fantasy Games at SportsHub Technologies
Twitter - @GregAmbrosius
Founder, National Fantasy Baseball Championship
General Manager, Consumer Fantasy Games at SportsHub Technologies
Twitter - @GregAmbrosius
-
Greg Ambrosius
- Posts: 41076
- Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2004 6:00 pm
- Contact:
Thoughts in prize distributions
The Prizes link will reflect the new overall prize structure for 2007 very shortly:
Overall Grand Champion $100,000, plus a crystal trophy
Second Place $20,000
Third Place $10,000
Fourth Place $5,000
Fifth Place $2,500
Sixth Place $1,500
Seventh Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
Eighth Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
Ninth Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
10th Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
Each (24) League Champion $5,000
Each (24) League 2nd place finisher $2,250
Each (24) League 3rd place finisher $750
Overall Grand Champion $100,000, plus a crystal trophy
Second Place $20,000
Third Place $10,000
Fourth Place $5,000
Fifth Place $2,500
Sixth Place $1,500
Seventh Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
Eighth Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
Ninth Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
10th Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
Each (24) League Champion $5,000
Each (24) League 2nd place finisher $2,250
Each (24) League 3rd place finisher $750
Greg Ambrosius
Founder, National Fantasy Baseball Championship
General Manager, Consumer Fantasy Games at SportsHub Technologies
Twitter - @GregAmbrosius
Founder, National Fantasy Baseball Championship
General Manager, Consumer Fantasy Games at SportsHub Technologies
Twitter - @GregAmbrosius
Thoughts in prize distributions
I have been having a difficult time with zeros. It seems that's what I come up with in studying the prize distributions between 10th and 11th as well as all of my teams. Anyone else admit to this problem.
THE ROUNDMANN
THE ROUNDMANN
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Corkedbats
- Posts: 75
- Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2005 6:00 pm
- Contact:
Thoughts in prize distributions
Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:
The Prizes link will reflect the new overall prize structure for 2007 very shortly:
Overall Grand Champion $100,000, plus a crystal trophy
Second Place $20,000
Third Place $10,000
Fourth Place $5,000
Fifth Place $2,500
Sixth Place $1,500
Seventh Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
Eighth Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
Ninth Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
10th Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
Each (24) League Champion $5,000
Each (24) League 2nd place finisher $2,250
Each (24) League 3rd place finisher $750 So how much does Krause really make?
I know in the 3 tampa leagues I didn't see but one single owner plopping $1250 assuming that NO ONE partners up and pays the extra hunderd bucks there would be $412,500.00 in the kitty.
Assuming half the league (which is low) pays the extra $100 for the partner the kitty would be $429,500.00
Prize money paid out is $316,000.00 with a gross surplus of $113,500.00.
I know you have to rent space at each city and pay the volunteers- Where does the rest of the money go?
Let's say 10k per hall per city that's 40k and let's put the personel at another 10k.
That would leave an extra $63,500. Does Greg get this money to wax his mustuche with?
Why not disclose all real expenses and payout every penny to the winners?
Just a thought for next season. You guys make you money publishing your rag...er magazine, you shouldn't profit on the game side of it. Don't respond by saying how your company lost money the first year, cause if you do, it's only going to look like you kept the extra money this season.
Looking forward to your spin...err..answer.
The Prizes link will reflect the new overall prize structure for 2007 very shortly:
Overall Grand Champion $100,000, plus a crystal trophy
Second Place $20,000
Third Place $10,000
Fourth Place $5,000
Fifth Place $2,500
Sixth Place $1,500
Seventh Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
Eighth Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
Ninth Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
10th Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
Each (24) League Champion $5,000
Each (24) League 2nd place finisher $2,250
Each (24) League 3rd place finisher $750 So how much does Krause really make?
I know in the 3 tampa leagues I didn't see but one single owner plopping $1250 assuming that NO ONE partners up and pays the extra hunderd bucks there would be $412,500.00 in the kitty.
Assuming half the league (which is low) pays the extra $100 for the partner the kitty would be $429,500.00
Prize money paid out is $316,000.00 with a gross surplus of $113,500.00.
I know you have to rent space at each city and pay the volunteers- Where does the rest of the money go?
Let's say 10k per hall per city that's 40k and let's put the personel at another 10k.
That would leave an extra $63,500. Does Greg get this money to wax his mustuche with?
Why not disclose all real expenses and payout every penny to the winners?
Just a thought for next season. You guys make you money publishing your rag...er magazine, you shouldn't profit on the game side of it. Don't respond by saying how your company lost money the first year, cause if you do, it's only going to look like you kept the extra money this season.
Looking forward to your spin...err..answer.
-
Greg Ambrosius
- Posts: 41076
- Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2004 6:00 pm
- Contact:
Thoughts in prize distributions
No spin needed. All I can say is that you're not very good at math. Don't forget, we make tons of money on auction leagues, Ultimate Leagues and satellite leagues. We're rich, we're rich, we're rich!!! 
Yeah, our rag has been making money for 17 years now, so there's no doubt we should contribute all winnings to the industry and good customers like you. I wish MLB Advanced Media would donate their licensing fees to you guys too. And I wish all of our advertising avenues were free. And I wish STATS would make the back-end support free. And I wish travel for all our employees to four cities and all other expenses were free. I wish that damn rent we have to pay at each facility was free. Then you'd guys have more money to win from us.
We pay back 75 percent of entry fees, not counting the co-manager fees, if we sell out. We've sold out the main event each of the last two years and hope to sell 360 or more spots in 2007. At the end of the day, I hope I can make money for our company because it was no fun losing money the first year. I don't get a penny of this as I'm just a great employee of a company I've enjoyed working at for 17 1/2 years. Everyone should be so lucky to have loyal employees like me and Tom!
Today we sent allocations for over $600,000 in prize money to accounting and checks will be in the mail no later than next week. My goal is to give out even more prize money next year, make even more money for my company and create an even more valuable entity than we had before 2004. I'll even buy more beers on Draft Day if it makes you happy. Hell, when I retire to a beach soon, I'll buy the beers at Margaritaville!
I'll be honest with you: We made money this year on the NFBC! I'm VERY happy about that. And I think we'll make money next year. And I promise to pay the prizes right away, to do my best to run good leagues, to honestly randomly select all of the leagues, monitor every league daily and even have fun doing all of this. I hope you enjoy every fantasy baseball league you compete in in 2007. And if that happens to be the NFBC, we'd love to have ya.
Yeah, our rag has been making money for 17 years now, so there's no doubt we should contribute all winnings to the industry and good customers like you. I wish MLB Advanced Media would donate their licensing fees to you guys too. And I wish all of our advertising avenues were free. And I wish STATS would make the back-end support free. And I wish travel for all our employees to four cities and all other expenses were free. I wish that damn rent we have to pay at each facility was free. Then you'd guys have more money to win from us.
We pay back 75 percent of entry fees, not counting the co-manager fees, if we sell out. We've sold out the main event each of the last two years and hope to sell 360 or more spots in 2007. At the end of the day, I hope I can make money for our company because it was no fun losing money the first year. I don't get a penny of this as I'm just a great employee of a company I've enjoyed working at for 17 1/2 years. Everyone should be so lucky to have loyal employees like me and Tom!
Today we sent allocations for over $600,000 in prize money to accounting and checks will be in the mail no later than next week. My goal is to give out even more prize money next year, make even more money for my company and create an even more valuable entity than we had before 2004. I'll even buy more beers on Draft Day if it makes you happy. Hell, when I retire to a beach soon, I'll buy the beers at Margaritaville!
I'll be honest with you: We made money this year on the NFBC!
I'm VERY happy about that. And I think we'll make money next year. And I promise to pay the prizes right away, to do my best to run good leagues, to honestly randomly select all of the leagues, monitor every league daily and even have fun doing all of this. I hope you enjoy every fantasy baseball league you compete in in 2007. And if that happens to be the NFBC, we'd love to have ya.Greg Ambrosius
Founder, National Fantasy Baseball Championship
General Manager, Consumer Fantasy Games at SportsHub Technologies
Twitter - @GregAmbrosius
Founder, National Fantasy Baseball Championship
General Manager, Consumer Fantasy Games at SportsHub Technologies
Twitter - @GregAmbrosius
-
Chest Rockwell
- Posts: 2400
- Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 6:00 pm
- Contact:
Thoughts in prize distributions
Originally posted by Corkedbats:
quote:Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:
The Prizes link will reflect the new overall prize structure for 2007 very shortly:
Overall Grand Champion $100,000, plus a crystal trophy
Second Place $20,000
Third Place $10,000
Fourth Place $5,000
Fifth Place $2,500
Sixth Place $1,500
Seventh Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
Eighth Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
Ninth Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
10th Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
Each (24) League Champion $5,000
Each (24) League 2nd place finisher $2,250
Each (24) League 3rd place finisher $750 So how much does Krause really make?
I know in the 3 tampa leagues I didn't see but one single owner plopping $1250 assuming that NO ONE partners up and pays the extra hunderd bucks there would be $412,500.00 in the kitty.
Assuming half the league (which is low) pays the extra $100 for the partner the kitty would be $429,500.00
Prize money paid out is $316,000.00 with a gross surplus of $113,500.00.
I know you have to rent space at each city and pay the volunteers- Where does the rest of the money go?
Let's say 10k per hall per city that's 40k and let's put the personel at another 10k.
That would leave an extra $63,500. Does Greg get this money to wax his mustuche with?
Why not disclose all real expenses and payout every penny to the winners?
Just a thought for next season. You guys make you money publishing your rag...er magazine, you shouldn't profit on the game side of it. Don't respond by saying how your company lost money the first year, cause if you do, it's only going to look like you kept the extra money this season.
Looking forward to your spin...err..answer. [/QUOTE]Mike- if you are who I think you are- you are one of my favorite people I have met in this contest. But I have got to call out of line on this one. You own your own company right? Do me a favor and email all of your customers from one specific division your P&L, business model, and a feedback form on how your current profits should be redistributed and copy Greg on that one.
If Greg is making too much money on this- the free market will teach him a lesson quite soon. I think most would place a high wager on that whatever operating income this event generates is not what is going to put him on the "fast track" at Krause and it would not shock me if a few suits at Krause do not see the value in all this effort going in to such a limited moneymaker.
Just one porn stars thoughts-
The one thing I agree with is I do not care if this thing lost money in the past. I am the customer that is not my problem- BUT I think most times that point has been made by Greg it has been more about supporting other issues not as an excuse to make a profit.
Simple people are in business to make a profit- and customers should be glad they are because it generally in most cases makes them a better company to purchase goods or services from.
quote:Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:
The Prizes link will reflect the new overall prize structure for 2007 very shortly:
Overall Grand Champion $100,000, plus a crystal trophy
Second Place $20,000
Third Place $10,000
Fourth Place $5,000
Fifth Place $2,500
Sixth Place $1,500
Seventh Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
Eighth Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
Ninth Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
10th Place $1,250 or Free NFBC Entry in 2008
Each (24) League Champion $5,000
Each (24) League 2nd place finisher $2,250
Each (24) League 3rd place finisher $750 So how much does Krause really make?
I know in the 3 tampa leagues I didn't see but one single owner plopping $1250 assuming that NO ONE partners up and pays the extra hunderd bucks there would be $412,500.00 in the kitty.
Assuming half the league (which is low) pays the extra $100 for the partner the kitty would be $429,500.00
Prize money paid out is $316,000.00 with a gross surplus of $113,500.00.
I know you have to rent space at each city and pay the volunteers- Where does the rest of the money go?
Let's say 10k per hall per city that's 40k and let's put the personel at another 10k.
That would leave an extra $63,500. Does Greg get this money to wax his mustuche with?
Why not disclose all real expenses and payout every penny to the winners?
Just a thought for next season. You guys make you money publishing your rag...er magazine, you shouldn't profit on the game side of it. Don't respond by saying how your company lost money the first year, cause if you do, it's only going to look like you kept the extra money this season.
Looking forward to your spin...err..answer. [/QUOTE]Mike- if you are who I think you are- you are one of my favorite people I have met in this contest. But I have got to call out of line on this one. You own your own company right? Do me a favor and email all of your customers from one specific division your P&L, business model, and a feedback form on how your current profits should be redistributed and copy Greg on that one.
If Greg is making too much money on this- the free market will teach him a lesson quite soon. I think most would place a high wager on that whatever operating income this event generates is not what is going to put him on the "fast track" at Krause and it would not shock me if a few suits at Krause do not see the value in all this effort going in to such a limited moneymaker.
Just one porn stars thoughts-
The one thing I agree with is I do not care if this thing lost money in the past. I am the customer that is not my problem- BUT I think most times that point has been made by Greg it has been more about supporting other issues not as an excuse to make a profit.
Simple people are in business to make a profit- and customers should be glad they are because it generally in most cases makes them a better company to purchase goods or services from.
Thoughts in prize distributions
They should make some money from this..it's a lot of #@$@#@ work..
Sometimes I'm good and sometimes I'm bad....but I always try real hard.
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Corkedbats
- Posts: 75
- Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2005 6:00 pm
- Contact:
Thoughts in prize distributions
Has anyone run the #'s on the champ? Obviously having a great draft is paramount. But has anyone taken a look at his competition in his league?
Bottom teams in his league held: JASON izzy, johnny gomes, brandon claussen, elzardo ramirez on their bench. Does anything think there may have been players with a pulse available in the free agent market?
I truly believe to win the overall you must have a really strong draft an excellent team and a few morons in your league that don't trot out the best available lineup. Who's to say there wasn't a better team but in a tougher league where people actually cut Jeff Fassero instead of keeping him on thier bench all season.
My 2 cents.
Congrats on Krause making money this season. I hope they make even more next season.
VIVA the porn 'stach
Bottom teams in his league held: JASON izzy, johnny gomes, brandon claussen, elzardo ramirez on their bench. Does anything think there may have been players with a pulse available in the free agent market?
I truly believe to win the overall you must have a really strong draft an excellent team and a few morons in your league that don't trot out the best available lineup. Who's to say there wasn't a better team but in a tougher league where people actually cut Jeff Fassero instead of keeping him on thier bench all season.
My 2 cents.
Congrats on Krause making money this season. I hope they make even more next season.
VIVA the porn 'stach
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Corkedbats
- Posts: 75
- Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2005 6:00 pm
- Contact:
Thoughts in prize distributions
Regarding the money post. I don't have a problem with them turning a profit. My point is... I don't want to see 600 teams competeting for the same $100k prize and the balance not going towards the competitors. How about publishing a matrix of if we hit 500 teams grand prize would be 150k 600 teams 200k etc. Just something to let everyone share in the expansion.
Thoughts in prize distributions
is corked bats drunk????
" i have never lost...just ran out of time!"
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Greg Ambrosius
- Posts: 41076
- Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2004 6:00 pm
- Contact:
Thoughts in prize distributions
Originally posted by Corkedbats:
Regarding the money post. I don't have a problem with them turning a profit. My point is... I don't want to see 600 teams competeting for the same $100k prize and the balance not going towards the competitors. How about publishing a matrix of if we hit 500 teams grand prize would be 150k 600 teams 200k etc. Just something to let everyone share in the expansion. What has led you to believe that if we continue to grow the NFBC we'd just keep all the remaining revenue? Our growth from 300 to 330 teams included the same 75% payout ratio with the extra money going toward increased league payouts. This year's payout plan for 360 teams includes the same 75% payout ratio with the extra money going towards second through 10th overall payouts. As I've stated in another post, the next expansion beyond 360 teams will go toward the overall grand prize as I also want that to grow beyond $100,000. I certainly can't give you a matrix for what the magic number of teams is to get to $150,000 because we may just increase league payouts down the line rather than go for the magical $200,000 number.
If I just keep the extra revenue, someone else will enter the market and provide a better prize payout than me and rightfully take some of my customers. I may look dumb, but I'm not stupid. The foundation has been set for the NFBC to grow each year and to add national sponsors, media coverage and more in future years. The payouts will grow and hopefully grow at a much faster pace than we've done during the first three years.
And I agree with you: I hope we do make more money next year.
Regarding the money post. I don't have a problem with them turning a profit. My point is... I don't want to see 600 teams competeting for the same $100k prize and the balance not going towards the competitors. How about publishing a matrix of if we hit 500 teams grand prize would be 150k 600 teams 200k etc. Just something to let everyone share in the expansion. What has led you to believe that if we continue to grow the NFBC we'd just keep all the remaining revenue? Our growth from 300 to 330 teams included the same 75% payout ratio with the extra money going toward increased league payouts. This year's payout plan for 360 teams includes the same 75% payout ratio with the extra money going towards second through 10th overall payouts. As I've stated in another post, the next expansion beyond 360 teams will go toward the overall grand prize as I also want that to grow beyond $100,000. I certainly can't give you a matrix for what the magic number of teams is to get to $150,000 because we may just increase league payouts down the line rather than go for the magical $200,000 number.
If I just keep the extra revenue, someone else will enter the market and provide a better prize payout than me and rightfully take some of my customers. I may look dumb, but I'm not stupid. The foundation has been set for the NFBC to grow each year and to add national sponsors, media coverage and more in future years. The payouts will grow and hopefully grow at a much faster pace than we've done during the first three years.
And I agree with you: I hope we do make more money next year.
Greg Ambrosius
Founder, National Fantasy Baseball Championship
General Manager, Consumer Fantasy Games at SportsHub Technologies
Twitter - @GregAmbrosius
Founder, National Fantasy Baseball Championship
General Manager, Consumer Fantasy Games at SportsHub Technologies
Twitter - @GregAmbrosius
Thoughts in prize distributions
Krause lobby according to Corkedbats:
Krause lobby reality:
Q
Krause lobby reality:
Q
Thoughts in prize distributions
Originally posted by Corkedbats:
Regarding the money post. I don't have a problem with them turning a profit. My point is... I don't want to see 600 teams competeting for the same $100k prize and the balance not going towards the competitors. How about publishing a matrix of if we hit 500 teams grand prize would be 150k 600 teams 200k etc. Just something to let everyone share in the expansion. You know, I'm about as liberal/Democratic as they come, but even I have to shake my head on this one. Krause is not a charitable non-profit organization; they are in business to make money. It is up to them to find the balance of payout versus profit versus customer satisfaction. For them to commit to an upfront publicly displayed matrix for their future business plans is ludicrous. This isn't a commune where "everyone share(s) in the expansion".
They provide a service, and we either buy it or not. If they're smart (and they are) then they know they'll have to increase the overall first place prize should registration boom to the 400+ team level. But it's not their responsibility to let us in on the process. I'm sure they'll listen (or at least pretend to), but it's real simple; if they screw up, then registrations will suffer and they'll have to make the appropriate changes. But it's their purpose to make a profit, and we need to understand that.
Regarding the money post. I don't have a problem with them turning a profit. My point is... I don't want to see 600 teams competeting for the same $100k prize and the balance not going towards the competitors. How about publishing a matrix of if we hit 500 teams grand prize would be 150k 600 teams 200k etc. Just something to let everyone share in the expansion. You know, I'm about as liberal/Democratic as they come, but even I have to shake my head on this one. Krause is not a charitable non-profit organization; they are in business to make money. It is up to them to find the balance of payout versus profit versus customer satisfaction. For them to commit to an upfront publicly displayed matrix for their future business plans is ludicrous. This isn't a commune where "everyone share(s) in the expansion".
They provide a service, and we either buy it or not. If they're smart (and they are) then they know they'll have to increase the overall first place prize should registration boom to the 400+ team level. But it's not their responsibility to let us in on the process. I'm sure they'll listen (or at least pretend to), but it's real simple; if they screw up, then registrations will suffer and they'll have to make the appropriate changes. But it's their purpose to make a profit, and we need to understand that.
"There is but one game and that game is baseball." – John McGraw
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Greg Ambrosius
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Thoughts in prize distributions
Originally posted by Quahogs:
Krause lobby according to Corkedbats:
Krause lobby reality:
Q Q, that's a good shot of my basement bar at home, but it doesn't do justice since you're missing the 62-inch big screen TV on the left-hand wall. Next time move 45 degrees to the right and use a wide angle lens and you'll see how we live in pure heaven here! Nice one.
Krause lobby according to Corkedbats:
Krause lobby reality:
Q Q, that's a good shot of my basement bar at home, but it doesn't do justice since you're missing the 62-inch big screen TV on the left-hand wall. Next time move 45 degrees to the right and use a wide angle lens and you'll see how we live in pure heaven here!
Nice one.Greg Ambrosius
Founder, National Fantasy Baseball Championship
General Manager, Consumer Fantasy Games at SportsHub Technologies
Twitter - @GregAmbrosius
Founder, National Fantasy Baseball Championship
General Manager, Consumer Fantasy Games at SportsHub Technologies
Twitter - @GregAmbrosius
Thoughts in prize distributions
BEF, I am not disagreeing with you but a matrix is no big deal. If someone is on the fence about signing up and they want to know the payout structure or percentages then a matrix only helps.
Its pretty easy to say at 360 entries the payout structure is X. 388 the payout structure is Y and 416 the payout structure is Z.
Its pretty easy to say at 360 entries the payout structure is X. 388 the payout structure is Y and 416 the payout structure is Z.
PokerGiveawayswww.rocksolidpoker.com
Thoughts in prize distributions
Originally posted by Corkedbats:
Has anyone run the #'s on the champ? Obviously having a great draft is paramount. But has anyone taken a look at his competition in his league?
Bottom teams in his league held: JASON izzy, johnny gomes, brandon claussen, elzardo ramirez on their bench. Does anything think there may have been players with a pulse available in the free agent market?
I truly believe to win the overall you must have a really strong draft an excellent team and a few morons in your league that don't trot out the best available lineup. Who's to say there wasn't a better team but in a tougher league where people actually cut Jeff Fassero instead of keeping him on thier bench all season.
My 2 cents.
Congrats on Krause making money this season. I hope they make even more next season.
VIVA the porn 'stach WINNING THE OVERALL SHOULD HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH TEAMS IN YOUR LEAGUE NOT PUTTING IN GOOD LINEUPS AT END OF SEASON, YOU ARE COMPETITING AGAINST THE BEST TEAMS FROM THE OTHER LEAGUES, SO THE WORST TEAMS IN YOUR OWN LEAGUE HAVE NO BEARING...
KP should make money the put on a class act competiton from beginning to end....
i think tom and greg should get a raise!
Has anyone run the #'s on the champ? Obviously having a great draft is paramount. But has anyone taken a look at his competition in his league?
Bottom teams in his league held: JASON izzy, johnny gomes, brandon claussen, elzardo ramirez on their bench. Does anything think there may have been players with a pulse available in the free agent market?
I truly believe to win the overall you must have a really strong draft an excellent team and a few morons in your league that don't trot out the best available lineup. Who's to say there wasn't a better team but in a tougher league where people actually cut Jeff Fassero instead of keeping him on thier bench all season.
My 2 cents.
Congrats on Krause making money this season. I hope they make even more next season.
VIVA the porn 'stach WINNING THE OVERALL SHOULD HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH TEAMS IN YOUR LEAGUE NOT PUTTING IN GOOD LINEUPS AT END OF SEASON, YOU ARE COMPETITING AGAINST THE BEST TEAMS FROM THE OTHER LEAGUES, SO THE WORST TEAMS IN YOUR OWN LEAGUE HAVE NO BEARING...
KP should make money the put on a class act competiton from beginning to end....
i think tom and greg should get a raise!
Thoughts in prize distributions
Whoops
Didnt mean to spam that poker site, I haven't posted in a while. Sorry.
Didnt mean to spam that poker site, I haven't posted in a while. Sorry.
PokerGiveawayswww.rocksolidpoker.com
Thoughts in prize distributions
This event has demonstrated willingness to pay out. Look at the percentages ESPN or CBS is giving back, and they don't have the operating expenses (compared to members/transactions) that the NFBC does. Anyone who wants to argue a lack of payout money is looking for something to complain about.
I agree with everything Rockwell said. Seriously.
I do agree with the matrix idea just because if you're signing up for a certain prize structure/# of players, it seems unfair to have it shift on you, but it's no big deal. I'm cofident that the NFBC will pay back any extra monies as they've always done in the past.
I agree with everything Rockwell said. Seriously.
I do agree with the matrix idea just because if you're signing up for a certain prize structure/# of players, it seems unfair to have it shift on you, but it's no big deal. I'm cofident that the NFBC will pay back any extra monies as they've always done in the past.
Chance favors the prepared mind.
Thoughts in prize distributions
Originally posted by fandango:
quote:Originally posted by Corkedbats:
Has anyone run the #'s on the champ? Obviously having a great draft is paramount. But has anyone taken a look at his competition in his league?
Bottom teams in his league held: JASON izzy, johnny gomes, brandon claussen, elzardo ramirez on their bench. Does anything think there may have been players with a pulse available in the free agent market?
I truly believe to win the overall you must have a really strong draft an excellent team and a few morons in your league that don't trot out the best available lineup. Who's to say there wasn't a better team but in a tougher league where people actually cut Jeff Fassero instead of keeping him on thier bench all season.
My 2 cents.
Congrats on Krause making money this season. I hope they make even more next season.
VIVA the porn 'stach WINNING THE OVERALL SHOULD HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH TEAMS IN YOUR LEAGUE NOT PUTTING IN GOOD LINEUPS AT END OF SEASON, YOU ARE COMPETITING AGAINST THE BEST TEAMS FROM THE OTHER LEAGUES, SO THE WORST TEAMS IN YOUR OWN LEAGUE HAVE NO BEARING...
KP should make money the put on a class act competiton from beginning to end....
i think tom and greg should get a raise! [/QUOTE]This is inaccurate. Bad competition in a league leads to better players on teams at the top of the league and therefore better teams in the overall. As I've posted elsewhere you can check competitive balance in a league by comparing point totals of places 2-4 in a league to places 9-11. You will find that teams that finish near the top of the overall consistently come from leagues with a huge differential as opposed to teams that finish first in their league but low in the overall.
[ October 03, 2006, 06:25 PM: Message edited by: bjoak ]
quote:Originally posted by Corkedbats:
Has anyone run the #'s on the champ? Obviously having a great draft is paramount. But has anyone taken a look at his competition in his league?
Bottom teams in his league held: JASON izzy, johnny gomes, brandon claussen, elzardo ramirez on their bench. Does anything think there may have been players with a pulse available in the free agent market?
I truly believe to win the overall you must have a really strong draft an excellent team and a few morons in your league that don't trot out the best available lineup. Who's to say there wasn't a better team but in a tougher league where people actually cut Jeff Fassero instead of keeping him on thier bench all season.
My 2 cents.
Congrats on Krause making money this season. I hope they make even more next season.
VIVA the porn 'stach WINNING THE OVERALL SHOULD HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH TEAMS IN YOUR LEAGUE NOT PUTTING IN GOOD LINEUPS AT END OF SEASON, YOU ARE COMPETITING AGAINST THE BEST TEAMS FROM THE OTHER LEAGUES, SO THE WORST TEAMS IN YOUR OWN LEAGUE HAVE NO BEARING...
KP should make money the put on a class act competiton from beginning to end....
i think tom and greg should get a raise! [/QUOTE]This is inaccurate. Bad competition in a league leads to better players on teams at the top of the league and therefore better teams in the overall. As I've posted elsewhere you can check competitive balance in a league by comparing point totals of places 2-4 in a league to places 9-11. You will find that teams that finish near the top of the overall consistently come from leagues with a huge differential as opposed to teams that finish first in their league but low in the overall.
[ October 03, 2006, 06:25 PM: Message edited by: bjoak ]
Chance favors the prepared mind.
Thoughts in prize distributions
Alert! Thread hijacking in process Seriously though, am I alone in thinking that in the non-main event the distributions don't seem to make sense?
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Cooperstown
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Thoughts in prize distributions
Way to bring the thread back Spy.
There does seem to be inconsistencies. But it's easier to see this when you take the amount for 1st, 2nd, 3rd as a percentage of the total prize.
In your 3rd example at the start, 2nd place gets 24.2% of the total prize but in the 1st 2 examples, 2nd place gets 22.5% of the total prize.
But what I noticed and find curious is that in the main event, each league winner gets the same 62.5% of the total prize, but 2nd gets a whopping 28% of the total, with 3rd only getting 9.5%.
That's a substantial difference from the satelite leagues. I would vote for more uniformity, and for a larger 3rd place award for the leagues.
There does seem to be inconsistencies. But it's easier to see this when you take the amount for 1st, 2nd, 3rd as a percentage of the total prize.
In your 3rd example at the start, 2nd place gets 24.2% of the total prize but in the 1st 2 examples, 2nd place gets 22.5% of the total prize.
But what I noticed and find curious is that in the main event, each league winner gets the same 62.5% of the total prize, but 2nd gets a whopping 28% of the total, with 3rd only getting 9.5%.
That's a substantial difference from the satelite leagues. I would vote for more uniformity, and for a larger 3rd place award for the leagues.
Thoughts in prize distributions
the last winning spot in any league (3rd place) should always get their money back in my opinion, otherwise dont bother having that prize spot. triple a
Triple A