2015 Hall of Fame Inductees

[Tom Kessenich]

Randy Johnson
Pedro Martinez
John Smoltz
Craig Biggio

[76erfan]

piazza was at 69 percent...he will get in next year

the other 4 i 100% agree with

[Brian Jenner]

Doesn't make sense to me how Schilling and Mussina have less votes combined (by a longshot) than Smoltz. Each of them has a pretty good case of being better than Smoltz.

Also, I'm waiting for the NFBC to get rid of their "Small Hall" mentality. What gives?

[Bronx Yankees]

I agree with the four that got in. Also very glad to see Tim Raines move up over 50%. He should have been elected years ago in my opinion. He now has two years left on the ballot. Hopefully, with a smaller class of sure-fire first-timers next year (Ken Griffey, Jr.), he'll get more votes.

Mike

[whale4evr]

. . . And Delgado is a one-and-done with 3.8%.

[Yah Mule]

A 15 year slash line of .291/.400/.502 and Brian Giles doesn't collect a single vote.

[Doctor Who]

Bout time Biggio got in. Why it took 3 years is beyond me. Wanted to know everyone's thoughts on Bagwell. Stuck at 50% again. He have a shot? Is it because of the clogged ballot? This guy played in a extreme pitchers park most of his career and has numbers similar to Gehrig and Mays yet doesn't get the respect. Everyone will say the reason is due to the alleged juicing, but his name doesn't appear anywhere on any list concerning this. If Bagwell would have played on the East Coast (DAMN YOU YOU EAST COASTERS ), he would have been a shoe-in. If it took Biggio 3 years to get in with 3k hits, I seriously wonder if the voter bias is what is to blame or does he really not deserve to be in the HOF?

[fozzie]

Bagwell was the stronger candidate than Biggio -- 1 MVP, 2 more yrs in top three, 3 more in top 10, Rookie of Year -- but he faces a couple of real problems: The switch from 15 years to 10 on the ballot really hurts him (those numbers will look better over time), and the East Coast voters don't respect him, in large part because of his postseason disappearances. I was shocked to see over the last month how many writers for ESPN and MLB.com voted for Fred McGriff but not for Bagwell. If Bagwell can't get even 60 percent of that influential batch of BBWAA members, he's not likely to get voted in.

[Red Sox Nation-]

Why does Smoltz get in first shot at 82.9% and Schilling get 39.2% on his third time around? If you look at the numbers these two aren't all that far from one another. Most stat heads would give Schilling a slight edge here minus the saves. I do feel Smoltz is a worthy candidate so this isn't a slight on him. I do think Schilling gets in the hall in a few years. Now that Maddux/Glavine/Pedro/Johnson/Smoltz are in the pitchers on the ballot won't stick out as much as these guys did.

[Roy's Outlaws]

Schilling and his Ketchup stained sock should NEVER get into the Hall of Fame ! Let look at Schilling number over his 20 year career. He was 216-146 ,A win percentage of .597 . ERA of 3.46 , Whip 1.137 , IP - 3261 , K's 3116 , K per 9 is 8.6 , He won 20 games 3x in his career , he pitched 85 complete games and 20 shutouts. He NEVER won a CY Young . The only reason Schilling even should get mentioned for the Hall is because of his Post season record of 11-2 with an ERA of 2.23 , and that includes a World Series record of 4-1. Schilling is Great at being a self promoter of himself and telling everyone how great he think he was. But the fact are that he was a little above average pitcher for his career , and a very good post season pitcher, but that NOT enough to get into the Hall .

Here I will give you another pitcher that should get into the Hall if Schilling ever get in, and he has NO chance of getting in . This pitcher had a 14 year career where he was 170-91 , a win percentage of .651 . ERA of 3.29 , Whip 1.184 , IP - 2392 , K's 1778 , K's per 9 is 6.9 . He also won 20 games 3x in his career, He pitched 95 complete games and had 26 shutouts . He won 1 Cy Young award. This pitcher post season record was 5-2 with an ERA of 3.02 , and that included a World Series record of 3-1.

Jason can you guess who this pitcher was ? I will give you the answer tomorrow. Roy

[Brian Jenner]

Don't know if trolling, or you actually think that's a good argument against Schilling...

He wasn't "a little above average". His career ERA+ was 127 which is the same as Bob Gibson and Tom Seaver. And yeah, like you mentioned he was also one of the best playoff pitchers of all time.

Is he an asshole? Yeah. A blowhard? Yup. But he is also definitely a hall of famer.

As for Ron Guidry, he had 800 IP less than Schilling and had a considerably worse ERA+ (119 vs 127). I think it's clear at this point that you're a biased Yankees fan, but I'm still not sure if it's intentional trolling.

[DOUGHBOYS]

Hall of Fame voting has changed. It is and has become Academy Award-like. Academy voters are high-fallutin folks. They like their artsy-fartsy movies. Slapstick comedy, black humor, and parody movies, not even considered for awards.
One of my favorite trivia questions from the past was this-
Name the only 'actor' who starred in movies that never lost money at the box office?
The answer was Elvis Presley.
The masses loved him.
I know that Elvis does not have Academy Award credentials. I know that. But, the distance between the masses and voters is illustrated.

Today's Hall of Fame voters have become snobs. Some, actually admitting that they vote for players based on how many years they have been on the ballot. Their performance and numbers never changing from year to year, only voters whims. As if taking pleasure in making some twist in the wind for years, before voted in.
They even believe it is up to them to decide who took steroids. They want to keep steroid users out of the Hall. I am convinced that Mike Piazza has not been voted in because some feel he used steroids.
This small group has become judge, jury, and executioner.
Not the American way.

Steroids happened. They are a part of baseball whether some want to admit it or not. Still are.
Some players cheated and took them. Some did not.
It is not up to the voters to decide what is in a man's heart.
Juan Marichal was kept out of the Hall of Fame for a few years. Folks knew why. Marichal knew why.
It was because he cracked Johnny Roseboro on the noggin with a bat.
A decision by Marichal on one day trashed all the Hall of Fame numbers accumulated through his years.
Roseboro made an impassioned plea on Marichal's behalf to voters.
The voters listened and voted him in. Marichal and Roseboro became the best of friends and Marichal was a Pall Bearer at Roseboro's funeral.
It shouldn't have come to that for voters.
Marichal should be voted in based on all the baseball numbers accumulated. Not for what was in his heart or a bad decision.
Now, some voters are wondering about Curt Schilling's heart and decisions.

I used to write the Hall of Fame on Joe Jackson's behalf, begging them to let him in the Hall. Jackson led the league or was second to Ty Cobb in a lot of batting races. His swing was the swing Babe Ruth copied.
He had Hall of Fame numbers.
Jackson was involved with the Black Sox scandal. Proof was minimal. But, a new Commisioner, trying to make a statement for baseball banished Jackson from the game.
And thus, excluded from the Hall.

Pete Rose is the all time hit leader. We all know his story.
Say what needs to be said about Rose. For me, it comes back to the first sentence of this paragraph.
Rose simply got caught doing what Ty Cobb and Tris Speaker did.
They are in the Hall. Rose is not.

Barry Bonds is the all time home run leader. When one thinks of Barry Bonds, steroids is soon to follow.
I hated Bonds. It's hard for me to 'hate' any player. What he did was take a mixture of elite baseball playing ability and put it on steroids.
I gritted my teeth each time he was cheered and revered.
Barry Bonds was the greatest player in baseball history to take steroids.
The best.
And even though I personally loathe the sombitch, I would vote for him.
What he did, cannot be ignored. That is the approach these voters are taking. Satires, slapstick, and Elvis movies are loved by the masses. Ignored by Academy voters as if non-existent.
Hall of Fame voters should not be the same.

Edit-
One day., the steroid bias will be gone. I believe that a player using steroids, unbeknownst to voters, will be voted in to the Hall. A story will break that the Hall of Fame player used steroids and that'll open the gate for other steroid users.
Is it right?
No.
In effect, the voters will be like the players themselves when making the decision to use steroids or not.
"Johnny uses them so Billy will too" is the same as "We voted Johnny in, so I will vote Billy in too".
Ugh

[Brian Jenner]

There is almost definitely a steroid user, if not many, already in the Hall of Fame. Athletes have been using them since the mid 1960's. Tests were openly done in 1965 to measure the effectiveness of three types of steroids on football players. The Olympics started testing for them in 1968. And I'm sure we all know the stories of amphetamine usage by pretty much everybody in baseball, including Hank Aaron. We have no clue if Griffey, Bagwell, Ripken, etc used PEDs. We can suspect they didn't, but then, who would have assumed Rafael Palmeiro was on them? He was as consistent as they come for his entire career and never had a spike to 50+ HR. And of course, Alex Sanchez and his career .076 ISO was the first player busted for using them. I don't know how anybody can claim to know.

[Yah Mule]

There is almost definitely a steroid user, if not many, already in the Hall of Fame. Athletes have been using them since the mid 1960's. Tests were openly done in 1965 to measure the effectiveness of three types of steroids on football players. The Olympics started testing for them in 1968. And I'm sure we all know the stories of amphetamine usage by pretty much everybody in baseball, including Hank Aaron. We have no clue if Griffey, Bagwell, Ripken, etc used PEDs. We can suspect they didn't, but then, who would have assumed Rafael Palmeiro was on them? He was as consistent as they come for his entire career and never had a spike to 50+ HR. And of course, Alex Sanchez and his career .076 ISO was the first player busted for using them. I don't know how anybody can claim to know.

In retrospect, the beginning of Raffy's steroid usage is easy to pinpoint. He hit 22 homers in 1992. Late in that season, Jose Canseco was traded to Texas. The following year, Palmeiro hit 37 homers and he remained among the home run leaderboards for the next decade.

[Brian Jenner]

Narratives are easy to form after the fact. How many people publicly suspected him before Canseco's book came out in his final season?? My point is, you never know whose doing them. I would assume almost all of the power hitters from the 90s were on them. Griffey, Frank Thomas, Thome, plus all the others that already have suspicion. Makes no sense to keep the best hitter in baseball out of the Hall of Fame, considering he was that much better than a league full of juiced up monsters.

[Yah Mule]

Narratives are easy to form after the fact. How many people publicly suspected him before Canseco's book came out in his final season?? My point is, you never know whose doing them. I would assume almost all of the power hitters from the 90s were on them. Griffey, Frank Thomas, Thome, plus all the others that already have suspicion. Makes no sense to keep the best hitter in baseball out of the Hall of Fame, considering he was that much better than a league full of juiced up monsters.

Yeah, that's why I began my statement with the words "in retrospect."

I knew the steroid thing would collapse like a house of cards and it did for the reason most illicit enterprises eventually are exposed: somebody couldn't keep his mouth shut. I didn't think it would be Canseco's unhappiness over being blackballed, though. I assumed it would be from some musclehead at a local gym blackmailing a player who used to buy drugs from him.

I totally disagree with the idea of broadstroking everybody who played as dirty. That's the excuse these guys are using to keep out Piazza and Bagwell and other guys with no smoking guns whatsoever.

It's time to just admit the Baseball Hall of Fame is screwed up beyond repair and there's little hope for improvement. I feel bad for individual players who care about it, but I just can't work up any real emotion one way or another anymore.

[Brian Jenner]

I'm not saying they're dirty, or advocating for them to be discredited for their accomplishments. But if I had to guess, I would say the fact that Griffey could put up 3 consecutive seasons of a 325+ ISO in the heart of the steroid era is pretty suspicious. Over the past 8 years nobody has done that even twice, and of the six players that did it once, two of them were suspended last season for PED usage. Again, I'm not saying he's guilty, or that he should be kept out of the Hall, or anything. I know there's a small chance he was clean, but if I had to bet, I sure as hell know where I'm placing my chips.

[Red Sox Nation-]

Schilling and his Ketchup stained sock should NEVER get into the Hall of Fame ! Let look at Schilling number over his 20 year career. He was 216-146 ,A win percentage of .597 . ERA of 3.46 , Whip 1.137 , IP - 3261 , K's 3116 , K per 9 is 8.6 , He won 20 games 3x in his career , he pitched 85 complete games and 20 shutouts. He NEVER won a CY Young . The only reason Schilling even should get mentioned for the Hall is because of his Post season record of 11-2 with an ERA of 2.23 , and that includes a World Series record of 4-1. Schilling is Great at being a self promoter of himself and telling everyone how great he think he was. But the fact are that he was a little above average pitcher for his career , and a very good post season pitcher, but that NOT enough to get into the Hall .

Here I will give you another pitcher that should get into the Hall if Schilling ever get in, and he has NO chance of getting in . This pitcher had a 14 year career where he was 170-91 , a win percentage of .651 . ERA of 3.29 , Whip 1.184 , IP - 2392 , K's 1778 , K's per 9 is 6.9 . He also won 20 games 3x in his career, He pitched 95 complete games and had 26 shutouts . He won 1 Cy Young award. This pitcher post season record was 5-2 with an ERA of 3.02 , and that included a World Series record of 3-1.

Jason can you guess who this pitcher was ? I will give you the answer tomorrow. Roy

Roy - I know you hate the man. How couldn't you after 2004? I thought after 10+ years you were over it. I don't need to defend his numbers. They are HOF worthy. See you in NYC buddy.

PS - Love the CAPS on "He NEVER won a CY Young". Did you know your lord and savior "Captain Jetes" NEVER won an MVP award?



Try to dig up some ketchup from his ankle for your next Yankee frank

[Roy's Outlaws]

Jason , your right I am not a fan of Schilling or any of the chicken sh*t player that try and blow smoke up my a** ,that they never did steroids. Bonds, Sosa, McGwire, Clemens, Palmeiro, Canseco, Giambi, A- Rod, Braun, Ect..Ect.... They all swear they are not doing anything, they are clean, How dare anyone question them, they have gotten better by hard work and practice. But it's the drugs that let them work harder and get bigger and faster. THATS A FACT.

As for Schilling ,A 20 year career with only 216 wins -- that's an average of 10.8 win per year . now even if you take out his first 4 season when he only won 4 game . So 16 season with a total of 212 wins - average out to 13.25 wins per season. That's the guy you want to but into the Hall OF Fame ? He had 10 of his 20 season in the majors that he won UNDER 10 Games.

If you remember that great game in Fenway in October of 1978 that Guidey pitched and Knock out the RED SOXS, also refer to as the BUCKY DENT GAME. That game should count in Guidey post season record ,and would make him 6-2. I'd take Guidey over Schilling every time and TWICE on Sunday. See you in a few months

[Roy's Outlaws]

Here is Schilling at his best.



Curt Schilling believes he didn’t make the Hall of Fame because he’s a Republican


Craig Calcaterra
Jan 7, 2015, 4:10 PM EST

232 Comments

Curt Schilling
AP


Curt Schilling: wonderful pitcher. But a guy who probably needs to stop, you know, saying things.

The latest thing he said was that he didn’t get the Hall of Fame votes John Smoltz got because the voters are biased against him because he’s a Republican. Here he is on WEEI today, trying to get his head around John Smoltz’s support:


“I think he got in because of [Greg] Maddux and [Tom] Glavine. I think the fact that they won 14 straight pennants. I think his ‘Swiss army knife versatility,’ which somebody said yesterday, I think he got a lot of accolades for that, I think he got a lot of recognition for that. He’s a Hall of Famer,” Schilling said. “And I think the other big thing is that I think he’s a Democrat and so I know that, as a Republican, that there’s some people that really don’t like that.”

Actually, Smoltz is not a Democrat. He has been reported to be “an avowed Republican,” and has been courted for political office in the past by the Republican party. Here are Smoltz’s political contribution records. Note the little “Rs” next to the candidates’ names. Oh, and Smoltz once compared gay marriage to beastiality, which tends not to be a pinko-liberal stance.

So, shockingly, Curt Schilling is full of crap about something. I know that may be hard to accept, so if you need a minute to gather yourself, please, take it.

UPDATE: Schilling is tweeting now that he was just kidding about that, but go listen to the interview (relevant part starts at the 6:45 mark). While, yes, the hosts laughed when he said it, there is no suggestion that he was just joking. And then, immediately after that, he goes into a non-joking thing about how the media is biased against people like him, suggesting that he does in fact have a persecution complex about all of this.

[TOXIC ASSETS]

Schilling belongs in the HOF.
* 20 years in the majors
* Excellent postseason pitcher and a World Series winner
* 15th all time in strikeouts
* One of only 4 pitchers in MLB history with more than 3,000 K's and less than 1,000 walks. P. Martinez, G. Maddux and F. Jenkins are the others
* Every pitcher ahead of him in strikeouts is in HOF except Clemens
* Played half of his career with bad Phillies teams yet career W-L record is still good
* 3.46 career ERA, in the steroid era, is pretty darn good.

[Brian Jenner]

There's no legitimate argument to keep him out using stats, it's pointless to try. It's the off-field stuff that will hurt him. Many people have unfavourable political views (including Smoltz if he compared being gay to being an animal lover) but Schilling was a loudmouth so everybody knows all the stupid stuff he believes. Any time you make a strong stance on any controversial topic, you alienate half of the voters. His recent tirade against evolution probably didn't help get any votes from the younger writers who probably tend to side more or Keith Law's side of that debacle.

[Yah Mule]

There's no legitimate argument to keep him out using stats, it's pointless to try. It's the off-field stuff that will hurt him. Many people have unfavourable political views (including Smoltz if he compared being gay to being an animal lover) but Schilling was a loudmouth so everybody knows all the stupid stuff he believes. Any time you make a strong stance on any controversial topic, you alienate half of the voters. His recent tirade against evolution probably didn't help get any votes from the younger writers who probably tend to side more or Keith Law's side of that debacle.

Whining incessantly about people accepting help from the government, then taking $75 million from Rhode Island - and complaining bitterly that he didn't get more - to fund his failed 38 Studios didn't help him, either.

Being an asshole hurts you in Hall of Fame voting. Ask Albert Belle or Kevin Brown if they believe that's true.

Of course, you can also be a great player and outstanding person who played for the same team for 19 years and still receive disgustingly shabby treatment from HOF voters. Ask Lou Whitaker about that.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/playe ... lo01.shtml

[TOXIC ASSETS]

What the hell does any of that stuff have to do with Schilling being in the HOF?

Ty Cobb is in and KILLED someone.

OJ Simpson is in his sports' HOF and KILLED two people.

Judge him by what he did on the field. Pete Rose also belongs in the HOF. Although he did clearly break the gambling rules and I wouldn't let him back in MLB to manage.

Rose or Schilling getting in or not getting in has no impact on my life either way, but let's try to use some common sense here.

[Yah Mule]

What the hell does any of that stuff have to do with Schilling being in the HOF?

Ty Cobb is in and KILLED someone.

OJ Simpson is in his sports' HOF and KILLED two people.

Judge him by what he did on the field. Pete Rose also belongs in the HOF. Although he did clearly break the gambling rules and I wouldn't let him back in MLB to manage.

Rose or Schilling getting in or not getting in has no impact on my life either way, but let's try to use some common sense here.

Yes, let's do that. Treat people like crap and they're less inclined to do you favors down the road. That's common sense. That's basic human nature and you see it in HOF voting in every sport. Some of them probably rationalize their behavior and others are simply grateful for an opportunity at a small measure of payback.