Nevada bans DFS

[Donacion]

Joins the other 4 states. News is saying the gaming people are looking at other states where they have operations. Does this impact season long also? Saw a report locally where local casinos might fill the gap and offer something.

[Donacion]

Not banned but requires a license. My understanding from friends in casino industry expensive.

[KJ Duke]

... and so begins the bureacratic money grab.

[BK METS]

http://espn.go.com/chalk/story/_/id/138 ... asy-sports

The NFL either trying to distance themselves from DFS or trying to downplay it.. Any way you look at it, this is not looking good.

[Outlaw]

http://gaming.nv.gov/index.aspx?page=16 ... index.aspx

[TParsons]

Shocking that the state that generates the majority of its revenue from b&m casinos would rule against DFS.

[Greg Ambrosius]

... and so begins the bureacratic money grab.

The ruling by the Nevada Gaming Control Board that Daily Fantasy Sports is gambling is obviously HUGE news for the industry. It's a headline grabber at a time when everyone is piling on the DFS industry. But it's also an example of stupid American politics at play.

Nevada's Gaming Control Board is catering to MGM's CEO and other casino operators. Plain and simple. Nevada residents didn't ask for this ruling, the casinos did. And Nevada is unique in that they can call this gambling and ask operators to get a license and pay appropriately to operate there. It's politics at play and it just hurts Nevada businesses who were getting revenue from DFS companies and those who were hosting fantasy companies in their state. And of course, it hurts Nevada residents who want to play DFS games.

Nevada is protecting its gaming businesses and making headlines against DFS. Same reason why fantasy can't be played in Arizona and Washington: They are protecting their Indian casinos and state lotteries. Let's call it like it is: Dumb politics.

This doesn't affect season-long games at this point, but it's still not good for the industry. Actually, these last two weeks have really sucked for the industry. Growth is being stymied by politics and stupidity. But it's time for the industry to come together, self-regulate our partners, put guidelines in place and show that we can grow and prosper legally. Then it will be up to the individual states and their residents to decide if this is good or not. Time to move forward and improve everyone.

[Donacion]

Good to hear season long not impacted by this. I'll be keeping an ear open on our local sports shows for information. I'm sure the casino industry saw the 10% DFS get and compared that to the 4.5% they get on traditional betting. We get hundreds of thousands of visitors every weekend that's a lot of potential revenue. Nevada residents will get something resembling DFS. Who knows you could see Fanduel and Draftkings Windows inside all the major casinos. My personal opinion is if the DFS guys get a license they will be admitting that daily is gambling. Personally I liked playing daily especially football, easy come easy go.

[devilznj]

Growth in this country is being stifled by politicians and stupidity via over regulation.

Only makes sense they'd come after a popular, growing industry.

[ToddZ]

I think the self-regulation ship has sailed.

DFS will survive. There will be changes but if things are done right, it will weed out (or slow down) the professionals and open things up to the more casual player to enter the space, someone who just wants to have fun and not be taken advantage of by a bankroll bully.

[Greg Ambrosius]

I think the self-regulation ship has sailed.

So in other words, ONLY the government can now save the day? That would be depressing if true.

I'm not trying to make light of it Todd, but I think you and several other people who know this space could write down 5 safeguards/guidelines that a regulator will mandate that could have been done months ago by the top DFS companies. Make this BETTER, SAFER, LEGAL for all U.S. citizens. It's obviously something that has caught on in a hurry and people want it, so why not find ways to make it work without having Prohibition? C'mon, we saw how that worked in the '30s.

This shouldn't be that hard, but we're making it hard.

[anpyanks]

Greg,

Are u really still gonna have drafts in Las Vegas? They want to try to destroy fantasy sports (I know it's daily but still) then they can go f--k themselves.

[KJ Duke]

I think the self-regulation ship has sailed.

There will be changes but if things are done right, it will weed out (or slow down) the professionals and open things up to the more casual player to enter the space, someone who just wants to have fun and not be taken advantage of by a bankroll bully.

I agree on the ship sailing, but usually when regulators enter the advantage goes to those with the most money so I'm skeptical any changes will be for the better of casual players. It will allow the two industry beasts to build a moat that makes it harder for other companies to enter the space; and what is best for FD/DK's biggest customers is probably how it will get regulated. It will clamp the insiders from playing, but probably isn't going to stop or slow the pro players.

[Greg Ambrosius]

Greg,

Are u really still gonna have drafts in Las Vegas? They want to try to destroy fantasy sports (I know it's daily but still) then they can go f--k themselves.

I sure am. We can boycott them all we want over this, but the bottom line is that Nevada residents will have to make the noise to get DFS back in the state. If we clean up our house there's no reason why every state wouldn't want to move forward with DFS. It's on us as an industry to do just that.

Nevada is protecting its own interests, not doing what's morally right. If they decide to shut down season-long games, then obviously that changes everything. But right now the Bellagio is still our home for 2016.

[Gekko]

Now Pennsylvania joins the states looking to squash DFS.

http://abc27.com/2015/10/16/pennsylvani ... -gambling/

[Greg Ambrosius]

Now Pennsylvania joins the states looking to squash DFS.

http://abc27.com/2015/10/16/pennsylvani ... -gambling/

This might be the worse plan of all: DFS only at the 12 Pennsylvania casinos. Now taking donations from casino lobbyists are ....

[Edwards Kings]

Now, now...the casino interests only want to wet their beaks just a little....



If any citizen or politician has a problem, their customer service is perfectly capable of rendering the necessary assistance...



After all, Nevada has a long tradition of doing what is right by the people...

[DOUGHBOYS]

Devil's advocate:

I know it's easy to fault politicians and deep pockets. Hell, I do it all the time.
At the same time, haven't the folks who run the daily games brought this on themselves?
Fer crissakes, we can't watch two minutes of television or be online five minutes before seeing one of their ads.
Folks have an instant distrust of flood marketing.
It happens every four years with politicians themselves.
We get it. They have millions of dollars in revenue that they're pouring into advertising.
It's the Publishers Clearinghouse ploy in the guise of fantasy.
Advertising that is directed at idiots who think they have a chance to win millions.
Beyond that, every bit of news that comes from the folks who run these games is BAD.

There are red flags.
Many.
It just seems like the 'growth' has come too fast.
Those involved in the industry want to back fantasy sports for the sake of fantasy sports.
No matter what.
We can't do that.
We have to remember WCOFF and people who do money grabs at the cost of all us poor schnooks who supported them.

They don't have a Greg or Tom. They don't have somebody that we can all trust.
No point man at all.
Their advertising is sleazy. Appealing to the man on the street, knowing they have professionals who will play against them.
Like calling for locals to join in a professional card game.
They're paying out a high percentage of money to a low percentage of contestants.
Is anything redder than a red flag?

Maybe the yearly game should be distancing itself from the daily game. Not standing beside it.
It is a completely different game. Joe Public doesn't know that though.
The absolute worst thing that can happen to the fantasy industry and for us, is for these companies to fail, owing their customers, backers, and advertisers millions of dollars.
We in fantasy, know that these companies fold. No matter how stable they appear before folding.
Failure of the two kingpins, or even one, would not just be news in the fantasy industry.
That would be a National news story. And fodder for ALL politicians in EVERY state.
It would make these state bans look puny.
The reaction would be swift and immediate.
If we thought WCOFF was a blow to the industry, something like that could be a deathnil for fantsy sports altogether.

Sincerely, Devil's Advocate

[ToddZ]

I think the self-regulation ship has sailed.

So in other words, ONLY the government can now save the day? That would be depressing if true.

I'm not trying to make light of it Todd, but I think you and several other people who know this space could write down 5 safeguards/guidelines that a regulator will mandate that could have been done months ago by the top DFS companies. Make this BETTER, SAFER, LEGAL for all U.S. citizens. It's obviously something that has caught on in a hurry and people want it, so why not find ways to make it work without having Prohibition? C'mon, we saw how that worked in the '30s.

This shouldn't be that hard, but we're making it hard.

Agree completely on paper - and they should have had the foresight to have many of these in place and/or pump the brakes as things were mushrooming.

Problem is, even if Ethan or anyone else has done nothing wrong, everyone is guilty by association in the court of public opinion. This is beyond the teenager begging the parents for one more chance. In order to appease the public, they need more than Nigel and Jason going on a Rotogrinders podcast explaining the internal regulation negotiated in concert with the FSTA or whatever.

[ToddZ]

I think the self-regulation ship has sailed.

There will be changes but if things are done right, it will weed out (or slow down) the professionals and open things up to the more casual player to enter the space, someone who just wants to have fun and not be taken advantage of by a bankroll bully.

I agree on the ship sailing, but usually when regulators enter the advantage goes to those with the most money so I'm skeptical any changes will be for the better of casual players. It will allow the two industry beasts to build a moat that makes it harder for other companies to enter the space; and what is best for FD/DK's biggest customers is probably how it will get regulated. It will clamp the insiders from playing, but probably isn't going to stop or slow the pro players.

Regulating multiple entry tournaments, eliminating scripting and prohibiting whales from killing the $1 and $2 entry space would definitely impact the professionals.

[ToddZ]

They don't have a Greg or Tom. They don't have somebody that we can all trust.
No point man at all.

Dan - this is an unfair statement. I'm not going to argue/belabor but it puts those that run the companies in an unfair and undeserved light.

Maybe the yearly game should be distancing itself from the daily game. Not standing beside it.
It is a completely different game. Joe Public doesn't know that though.
The absolute worst thing that can happen to the fantasy industry and for us, is for these companies to fail, owing their customers, backers, and advertisers millions of dollars.
We in fantasy, know that these companies fold. No matter how stable they appear before folding.
Failure of the two kingpins, or even one, would not just be news in the fantasy industry.
That would be a National news story. And fodder for ALL politicians in EVERY state.

So long as everyone in the industry is lumped under the UIGEA umbrella, we absolutely have to stay united. Once everything fleshes out we can choose to embrace it or distance ourselves, but so long as we're all lumped under the fantasy sports mantra, we need to stand together and support each other.

[KJ Duke]

I think the self-regulation ship has sailed.

There will be changes but if things are done right, it will weed out (or slow down) the professionals and open things up to the more casual player to enter the space, someone who just wants to have fun and not be taken advantage of by a bankroll bully.

I agree on the ship sailing, but usually when regulators enter the advantage goes to those with the most money so I'm skeptical any changes will be for the better of casual players. It will allow the two industry beasts to build a moat that makes it harder for other companies to enter the space; and what is best for FD/DK's biggest customers is probably how it will get regulated. It will clamp the insiders from playing, but probably isn't going to stop or slow the pro players.

Regulating multiple entry tournaments, eliminating scripting and prohibiting whales from killing the $1 and $2 entry space would definitely impact the professionals.

Which is why I don't think it will happen, unless there are other concessions or workarounds to keep the biggest players happy.

[DOUGHBOYS]

Dan - this is an unfair statement. I'm not going to argue/belabor but it puts those that run the companies in an unfair and undeserved light.

I trust YOU, Todd, so I will just bow to you on this point.

Maybe the yearly game should be distancing itself from the daily game. Not standing beside it.
It is a completely different game. Joe Public doesn't know that though.
The absolute worst thing that can happen to the fantasy industry and for us, is for these companies to fail, owing their customers, backers, and advertisers millions of dollars.
We in fantasy, know that these companies fold. No matter how stable they appear before folding.
Failure of the two kingpins, or even one, would not just be news in the fantasy industry.
That would be a National news story. And fodder for ALL politicians in EVERY state.

So long as everyone in the industry is lumped under the UIGEA umbrella, we absolutely have to stay united. Once everything fleshes out we can choose to embrace it or distance ourselves, but so long as we're all lumped under the fantasy sports mantra, we need to stand together and support each other.

I am hoping that that is spoken as an Englishman trusted Churchill while German bombs descended every night.
Not like a Private in Custer's Cavalry.
Fingers crossed

[Donacion]

I'm trying to envision what a casino run DFS game would like. As a Nevada resident I can currently bet online as long as I do it physically in Nevada. I would assume DFS would be the same. I can see some sort of Over/Under scenario. Head to head games with the casino as the other side. Certainly a 50/50 game. Prop bets of every type. High stakes games along with the standard tournaments. It is my understanding the casinos can offer DFS immediately if they choose since they already possess the licenses. I don't see the Fanduels and Draftkings applying for gambling licenses.

[ToddZ]

Which is why I don't think it will happen, unless there are other concessions or workarounds to keep the biggest players happy.

There was already a movement -- before all this occured -- to get some of this self-regulated, led by many of the whales. One (actually a team of two), in particular, took on the pros flooding the $1 and $2 H2H market looking for minnows to take their games by taking ALL, and I mean ALL of the pros $1 and $2 games.

The scripting is opposed by those relying more on baseball/football player evaluation than game theory hedging for success.

There are also pros that were publicly against multiple entries but the resistance wasn't as strong since that is needed to fuel the huge prizes.

Hmm -- sounds familiar.