AROD team prediction???
AROD team prediction???
with the potential for torre leaving and a mass exodus of free agents and retirees and another year without a world series...i predict arod leaves for the CUBS. he gets to move back to ss, hit in nl parks and most importantly reunite with his favorie manager sweet"loco"lou and becomes the face of the orginization, no more backseat to jeter. thoughts???
" i have never lost...just ran out of time!"
-
CC's Desperados
- Posts: 2558
- Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2004 6:00 pm
AROD team prediction???
Originally posted by RoundTrippers:
with the potential for torre leaving and a mass exodus of free agents and retirees and another year without a world series...i predict arod leaves for the CUBS. he gets to move back to ss, hit in nl parks and most importantly reunite with his favorie manager sweet"loco"lou and becomes the face of the orginization, no more backseat to jeter. thoughts??? It's a done deal!! He signs a eight year deal for $30 milions a year with the Cubs.
Can you imagime Mark Cuban harassing all the umpires? He was starting to look a little evil last year. I think winning the NBA title has him a little possessed.
with the potential for torre leaving and a mass exodus of free agents and retirees and another year without a world series...i predict arod leaves for the CUBS. he gets to move back to ss, hit in nl parks and most importantly reunite with his favorie manager sweet"loco"lou and becomes the face of the orginization, no more backseat to jeter. thoughts??? It's a done deal!! He signs a eight year deal for $30 milions a year with the Cubs.
Can you imagime Mark Cuban harassing all the umpires? He was starting to look a little evil last year. I think winning the NBA title has him a little possessed.
AROD team prediction???
Cubs don't need another curse - when the Yanks signed A-Rod I predicted they'd never win a WS while he was on their team.
He's not a Cub-type player, more so I'd say he is the anti-Cub. While unknowing fans may like his talent, hard core Cub fans won't like his attitude. He would be a regrettable signing for the Cubs over time. Maybe he'd work as a Met.
[ October 10, 2007, 01:42 PM: Message edited by: KJ Duke ]
He's not a Cub-type player, more so I'd say he is the anti-Cub. While unknowing fans may like his talent, hard core Cub fans won't like his attitude. He would be a regrettable signing for the Cubs over time. Maybe he'd work as a Met.
[ October 10, 2007, 01:42 PM: Message edited by: KJ Duke ]
AROD team prediction???
KJ why do you say attitude? I have run into him in real life and he was very nice. A friend of mine also grew up with his wife and she is a big fan of her.
AROD team prediction???
If this is just about money (I.E. - moving back to shortstop is not an issue), then Alex Rodriguez will re-sign with the Yankees. The Yankees have the deepest pockets and will pay whatever it takes to keep their best player in the fold.
Kevin
Kevin
"Fear ... that's the other guy's problem!" - Lewis Winthorpe (Dan Akroyd) from Trading Places
AROD team prediction???
Well, I predict the California/Anaheim/Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim sign him.
Yea yea yea, wishful thinking.
Yea yea yea, wishful thinking.
AROD team prediction???
Originally posted by KJ Duke:
He's not a Cub-type player, more so I'd say he is the anti-Cub. While unknowing fans may like his talent, hard core Cub fans won't like his attitude. He would be a regrettable signing for the Cubs over time. Maybe he'd work as a Met. Well maybe that thinking is why the cubbies are 0 for the last 100. Maybe it's time for a Prima Donna. Just his bat alone should guarantee them that sad division and maybe home field for at least during the 5 game playoff. Once in the playoffs he can be a lightning rod and draw the negative press toward his sad playoff performances and away from 100 year droughts
and goat curses :rolleyes: 
He's not a Cub-type player, more so I'd say he is the anti-Cub. While unknowing fans may like his talent, hard core Cub fans won't like his attitude. He would be a regrettable signing for the Cubs over time. Maybe he'd work as a Met. Well maybe that thinking is why the cubbies are 0 for the last 100. Maybe it's time for a Prima Donna. Just his bat alone should guarantee them that sad division and maybe home field for at least during the 5 game playoff. Once in the playoffs he can be a lightning rod and draw the negative press toward his sad playoff performances and away from 100 year droughts
and goat curses :rolleyes: -
Edwards Kings
- Posts: 5910
- Joined: Sun Mar 14, 2004 6:00 pm
- Location: Duluth, Georgia
AROD team prediction???
And move Soriano back to 2B and have an infield of D. Lee, A. Soriano, ARod and AmRam. Yup...that would be worth the price of admission.
Arod to Boston...bye-bye Lugo.
Arod to Boston...bye-bye Lugo.
Baseball is a slow, boring, complex, cerebral game that doesn't lend itself to histrionics. You 'take in' a baseball game, something odd to say about a football or basketball game, with the clock running and the bodies flying.
Charles Krauthammer
Charles Krauthammer
-
CC's Desperados
- Posts: 2558
- Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2004 6:00 pm
AROD team prediction???
Originally posted by KJ Duke:
Cubs don't need another curse - when the Yanks signed A-Rod I predicted they'd never win a WS while he was on their team.
He's not a Cub-type player, more so I'd say he is the anti-Cub. While unknowing fans may like his talent, hard core Cub fans won't like his attitude. He would be a regrettable signing for the Cubs over time. Maybe he'd work as a Met. I don't think A-Rod is the reason the Yankees didn't win. They wouldn't have made the play-offs this year without him.
In order to win the World Series, you need three things. A hitter who you can get a big hit. A starting pitcher who can win a big game. And closer who can get a big out in a toughs spot.
As I don't think A-Rod is the player who will get the big hit late in games, I do think he is a solid piece to a winning team. Many people thought the same thing about Manny Ramirez. Ortiz is the reason Boston won the World Series, but Manny was also a reason they made it there. A-Rod would play a similar role as Manny for the Red Sox. He leads them there, but he can't win it for them. As A-Rod gets older, he might develop that part of his game as Bonds did.
If A-Rod went to the Cubs, they would still need a strong lefty bat. They don't have a closer who can get a big out. At this point, they don't have a pitcher who can win the big game consistently.
The Cubs have a few nice pieces, but they need to find a few more. If money is no object, A-Rod is the best player out there. If you prefer watching a player like Theriot play short, it could be years before they win the World Series. The time is now for the Cubs. They need to build off of this year.
[ October 10, 2007, 04:16 PM: Message edited by: CC's Desperados ]
Cubs don't need another curse - when the Yanks signed A-Rod I predicted they'd never win a WS while he was on their team.
He's not a Cub-type player, more so I'd say he is the anti-Cub. While unknowing fans may like his talent, hard core Cub fans won't like his attitude. He would be a regrettable signing for the Cubs over time. Maybe he'd work as a Met. I don't think A-Rod is the reason the Yankees didn't win. They wouldn't have made the play-offs this year without him.
In order to win the World Series, you need three things. A hitter who you can get a big hit. A starting pitcher who can win a big game. And closer who can get a big out in a toughs spot.
As I don't think A-Rod is the player who will get the big hit late in games, I do think he is a solid piece to a winning team. Many people thought the same thing about Manny Ramirez. Ortiz is the reason Boston won the World Series, but Manny was also a reason they made it there. A-Rod would play a similar role as Manny for the Red Sox. He leads them there, but he can't win it for them. As A-Rod gets older, he might develop that part of his game as Bonds did.
If A-Rod went to the Cubs, they would still need a strong lefty bat. They don't have a closer who can get a big out. At this point, they don't have a pitcher who can win the big game consistently.
The Cubs have a few nice pieces, but they need to find a few more. If money is no object, A-Rod is the best player out there. If you prefer watching a player like Theriot play short, it could be years before they win the World Series. The time is now for the Cubs. They need to build off of this year.
[ October 10, 2007, 04:16 PM: Message edited by: CC's Desperados ]
AROD team prediction???
I'm not arguing the Cubs need for talent like him. But ... there are "complete" teams that lack chemistry and don't win, especially in the playoffs. A-Rod is to me, the kind of player that can throw off team chemistry. Not every team, but some. The Cubs are one of those teams (Yankees too). And, in spite of his talent, Cubs fans would not embrace him.
Spy - a lot of guys seem friendly in person - less of them when you spend everyday with them. He comes across as smug, not to mention money-hungry. That won't play with Cub fans. Cub fans want their best players to be good guys too - Dawson, Sandberg, D Lee, Zambrano (despite his antics).
[ October 10, 2007, 05:03 PM: Message edited by: KJ Duke ]
Spy - a lot of guys seem friendly in person - less of them when you spend everyday with them. He comes across as smug, not to mention money-hungry. That won't play with Cub fans. Cub fans want their best players to be good guys too - Dawson, Sandberg, D Lee, Zambrano (despite his antics).
[ October 10, 2007, 05:03 PM: Message edited by: KJ Duke ]
AROD team prediction???
True, I only spent 2 hours next to him at Sarafinas and observing him. He was unfailingly nice and generous to everyone (esp. the kids) who came up to him, even though he was out with his whole family and I am sure didn't want to be bothered. I actually did 'run' into him as I was walking between tables and bumped him by accident (I didn't even realize it was him at first) and he was cool about the whole thing.
AROD team prediction???
Originally posted by Spyhunter:
True, I only spent 2 hours next to him at Sarafinas and observing him. He was unfailingly nice and generous to everyone (esp. the kids) who came up to him, even though he was out with his whole family and I am sure didn't want to be bothered. I actually did 'run' into him as I was walking between tables and bumped him by accident (I didn't even realize it was him at first) and he was cool about the whole thing. so at least he's a step above Barry Bonds
True, I only spent 2 hours next to him at Sarafinas and observing him. He was unfailingly nice and generous to everyone (esp. the kids) who came up to him, even though he was out with his whole family and I am sure didn't want to be bothered. I actually did 'run' into him as I was walking between tables and bumped him by accident (I didn't even realize it was him at first) and he was cool about the whole thing. so at least he's a step above Barry Bonds
AROD team prediction???
Saying he's not a clubhouse guy or that he will kill a team's playoff chances seems a little like wishful thinking. You're looking for any generic fault you can place at his feet since it is so difficult to find fault with his actual day-to-day performance in the field.
The only thing the Cubs and Yankees have in common is that they are two of the only places where he won't be sucking up all of the payroll and destroying the team if he falls off a cliff six years from now (what is soon to be known as the Barry Zito Effect). They can afford the risk even more than they can afford him.
Finally--and this is a good lesson not just for this thread but for life--if your example of a good player for the money/good clubhouse guy/good player for team chemistry/good fantasy 4th round pick or really anything else positive is Carlos Zambrano, then you've instantly destroyed any credibility you had.
[ October 10, 2007, 09:30 PM: Message edited by: bjoak ]
The only thing the Cubs and Yankees have in common is that they are two of the only places where he won't be sucking up all of the payroll and destroying the team if he falls off a cliff six years from now (what is soon to be known as the Barry Zito Effect). They can afford the risk even more than they can afford him.
Finally--and this is a good lesson not just for this thread but for life--if your example of a good player for the money/good clubhouse guy/good player for team chemistry/good fantasy 4th round pick or really anything else positive is Carlos Zambrano, then you've instantly destroyed any credibility you had.
[ October 10, 2007, 09:30 PM: Message edited by: bjoak ]
Chance favors the prepared mind.
AROD team prediction???
Originally posted by bjoak:
Saying he's not a clubhouse guy or that he will kill a team's playoff chances seems a little like wishful thinking. You're looking for any generic fault you can place at his feet since it is so difficult to find fault with his actual day-to-day performance in the field.
The only thing the Cubs and Yankees have in common is that they are two of the only places where he won't be sucking up all of the payroll and destroying the team if he falls off a cliff six years from now (what is soon to be known as the Barry Zito Effect). They can afford the risk even more than they can afford him.
Finally--and this is a good lesson not just for this thread but for life--if your example of a good player for the money/good clubhouse guy/good player for team chemistry/good fantasy 4th round pick or really anything else positive is Carlos Zambrano, then you've instantly destroyed any credibility you had. Non-Cub fans don't really get why Cub fans are Cub fans, what the players mean to them, types of players, etc.
Secondly, Zambrano is loved by Cubs fans, took less money to stay in Chicago long-term at a bargain rate and is considered a great teammate so long as you are not Michael Barrett. Some opposing players don't like him because he's emotional. So was Ernie Banks, Ron Santo, etc etc.
Thirdly, Zambrano had a bad stretch this season, take that bad stretch out and was as dominant as any pitcher in the game. He also is one of the most durable pitchers in the game.
Saying he's not a clubhouse guy or that he will kill a team's playoff chances seems a little like wishful thinking. You're looking for any generic fault you can place at his feet since it is so difficult to find fault with his actual day-to-day performance in the field.
The only thing the Cubs and Yankees have in common is that they are two of the only places where he won't be sucking up all of the payroll and destroying the team if he falls off a cliff six years from now (what is soon to be known as the Barry Zito Effect). They can afford the risk even more than they can afford him.
Finally--and this is a good lesson not just for this thread but for life--if your example of a good player for the money/good clubhouse guy/good player for team chemistry/good fantasy 4th round pick or really anything else positive is Carlos Zambrano, then you've instantly destroyed any credibility you had. Non-Cub fans don't really get why Cub fans are Cub fans, what the players mean to them, types of players, etc.
Secondly, Zambrano is loved by Cubs fans, took less money to stay in Chicago long-term at a bargain rate and is considered a great teammate so long as you are not Michael Barrett. Some opposing players don't like him because he's emotional. So was Ernie Banks, Ron Santo, etc etc.
Thirdly, Zambrano had a bad stretch this season, take that bad stretch out and was as dominant as any pitcher in the game. He also is one of the most durable pitchers in the game.
AROD team prediction???
BTW, I will be excited to see your post about how A-Rod sucks and is not really a Cubbie type if he is launching his 60th homerun for the lovable losers next year. "God, I hate getting all that production out of one player. You know what it is? It's that crappy satisfied feeling you get when someone is helping your team win. And he's creating static with our team shortstop, 10 time gold glover, perennial all-star, Ryan Theriot. Trade A-Rod now!"
Chance favors the prepared mind.
AROD team prediction???
Originally posted by bjoak:
BTW, I will be excited to see your post about how A-Rod sucks and is not really a Cubbie type if he is launching his 60th homerun for the lovable losers next year. "God, I hate getting all that production out of one player. You know what it is? It's that crappy satisfied feeling you get when someone is helping your team win. And he's creating static with our team shortstop, 10 time gold glover, perennial all-star, Ryan Theriot. Trade A-Rod now!" I think you mis-read my opinion on A-Rod. Try again.
FYI, I cashed an A-Rod over Ryan Howard side-bet check from sportsbettingman. I expected him to be one of the top offensive players in the game last year, and expect more of the same for 08. He will be good for some team, just not the Cubs. I wouldnt mind seeing Jose Reyes in a Cub uniform and A-Rod in a Met uniform one bit.
He did have a pretty good season with the Yankees didn't he? Oh, and what are A-Rod's Yankees doing right now? Licking their 1st-rd playoff wounds, same as the Cubs. If the Yanks haven't been able to make it into the Series since they signed him, what makes you think the Cubs will? He was supposed to make the most dominant franchise in baseball even more so, but they've regressed since they got him.
[ October 10, 2007, 11:07 PM: Message edited by: KJ Duke ]
BTW, I will be excited to see your post about how A-Rod sucks and is not really a Cubbie type if he is launching his 60th homerun for the lovable losers next year. "God, I hate getting all that production out of one player. You know what it is? It's that crappy satisfied feeling you get when someone is helping your team win. And he's creating static with our team shortstop, 10 time gold glover, perennial all-star, Ryan Theriot. Trade A-Rod now!" I think you mis-read my opinion on A-Rod. Try again.
FYI, I cashed an A-Rod over Ryan Howard side-bet check from sportsbettingman. I expected him to be one of the top offensive players in the game last year, and expect more of the same for 08. He will be good for some team, just not the Cubs. I wouldnt mind seeing Jose Reyes in a Cub uniform and A-Rod in a Met uniform one bit.
He did have a pretty good season with the Yankees didn't he? Oh, and what are A-Rod's Yankees doing right now? Licking their 1st-rd playoff wounds, same as the Cubs. If the Yanks haven't been able to make it into the Series since they signed him, what makes you think the Cubs will? He was supposed to make the most dominant franchise in baseball even more so, but they've regressed since they got him.
[ October 10, 2007, 11:07 PM: Message edited by: KJ Duke ]
AROD team prediction???
Originally posted by Edwards Kings:
And move Soriano back to 2B and have an infield of D. Lee, A. Soriano, ARod and AmRam. Yup...that would be worth the price of admission.
Arod to Boston...bye-bye Lugo. While I am on a roll, I was assuming you guys were talking about trading Ramirez to get A-Rod or something which admittedly didn't make sense to me but whatever. I can't keep track of free agents either. I thought the Cubs might need a 3B.
But, yeah, let's put A-Rod back at short, which most experts agree A-Rod could not handle now that he's barely an adequate third baseman, along with Soriano, the worst second baseman since...ever, and Ramirez who fields like a humpback to create the worst infield defense of all time. This is why fantasy leaguers shouldn't run teams.
But, yes, I'd pay the price of admission to see the hilarity ensue as the defense goes after a ball like an old guy going after a skirt on the Benny Hill show, and then groundball pitcher Zambrano chasing his teammates around the field with that confused caveman look on his face. Ugah.
[ October 10, 2007, 11:07 PM: Message edited by: bjoak ]
And move Soriano back to 2B and have an infield of D. Lee, A. Soriano, ARod and AmRam. Yup...that would be worth the price of admission.
Arod to Boston...bye-bye Lugo. While I am on a roll, I was assuming you guys were talking about trading Ramirez to get A-Rod or something which admittedly didn't make sense to me but whatever. I can't keep track of free agents either. I thought the Cubs might need a 3B.
But, yeah, let's put A-Rod back at short, which most experts agree A-Rod could not handle now that he's barely an adequate third baseman, along with Soriano, the worst second baseman since...ever, and Ramirez who fields like a humpback to create the worst infield defense of all time. This is why fantasy leaguers shouldn't run teams.
But, yes, I'd pay the price of admission to see the hilarity ensue as the defense goes after a ball like an old guy going after a skirt on the Benny Hill show, and then groundball pitcher Zambrano chasing his teammates around the field with that confused caveman look on his face. Ugah.
[ October 10, 2007, 11:07 PM: Message edited by: bjoak ]
Chance favors the prepared mind.
AROD team prediction???
Originally posted by bjoak:
quote:Originally posted by Edwards Kings:
And move Soriano back to 2B and have an infield of D. Lee, A. Soriano, ARod and AmRam. Yup...that would be worth the price of admission.
Arod to Boston...bye-bye Lugo. While I am on a roll, I was assuming you guys were talking about trading Ramirez to get A-Rod or something which admittedly didn't make sense to me but whatever. I can't keep track of free agents either. I thought the Cubs might need a 3B.
But, yeah, let's put A-Rod back at short, which most experts agree A-Rod could not handle now that he's barely an adequate third baseman, along with Soriano, the worst second baseman since...ever, and Ramirez who fields like a humpback to create the worst infield defense of all time. This is why fantasy leaguers shouldn't run teams.
But, yes, I'd pay the price of admission to see the hilarity ensue as the defense goes after a ball like an old guy going after a skirt on the Benny Hill show, and then groundball pitcher Zambrano chasing his teammates around the field with that confused caveman look on his face. Ugah. [/QUOTE]Aramis played very good D for the second straight season. He was horrible 3-4 years ago. Try to keep up with the times bjoak.
quote:Originally posted by Edwards Kings:
And move Soriano back to 2B and have an infield of D. Lee, A. Soriano, ARod and AmRam. Yup...that would be worth the price of admission.
Arod to Boston...bye-bye Lugo. While I am on a roll, I was assuming you guys were talking about trading Ramirez to get A-Rod or something which admittedly didn't make sense to me but whatever. I can't keep track of free agents either. I thought the Cubs might need a 3B.
But, yeah, let's put A-Rod back at short, which most experts agree A-Rod could not handle now that he's barely an adequate third baseman, along with Soriano, the worst second baseman since...ever, and Ramirez who fields like a humpback to create the worst infield defense of all time. This is why fantasy leaguers shouldn't run teams.
But, yes, I'd pay the price of admission to see the hilarity ensue as the defense goes after a ball like an old guy going after a skirt on the Benny Hill show, and then groundball pitcher Zambrano chasing his teammates around the field with that confused caveman look on his face. Ugah. [/QUOTE]Aramis played very good D for the second straight season. He was horrible 3-4 years ago. Try to keep up with the times bjoak.
AROD team prediction???
Mm, The Filding Bible had him at -12, but as you say that info is out of date. Other metrics show him to be consistantly bad every year including 2006, with a good 2007, probably an outlier rather than real improvement as he is starting to get up there in years.
Chance favors the prepared mind.
AROD team prediction???
Originally posted by bjoak:
Mm, The Filding Bible had him at -12, but as you say that info is out of date. Other metrics show him to be consistantly bad every year including 2006, with a good 2007, probably an outlier rather than real improvement as he is starting to get up there in years. Last two seasons, team stats show Cubs had the least number of errors in the league at 3B. Second in fielding pct both years.
He came to the Cubs a bad 3b. He worked extensively with coaches to improve after that 1st season and has looked very good since. Doesn't have the range of some 3Bs, as he isn't exactly a skinny dude - but a strong consistent arm and makes the plays he should make. He's 29, btw.
[ October 10, 2007, 11:31 PM: Message edited by: KJ Duke ]
Mm, The Filding Bible had him at -12, but as you say that info is out of date. Other metrics show him to be consistantly bad every year including 2006, with a good 2007, probably an outlier rather than real improvement as he is starting to get up there in years. Last two seasons, team stats show Cubs had the least number of errors in the league at 3B. Second in fielding pct both years.
He came to the Cubs a bad 3b. He worked extensively with coaches to improve after that 1st season and has looked very good since. Doesn't have the range of some 3Bs, as he isn't exactly a skinny dude - but a strong consistent arm and makes the plays he should make. He's 29, btw.
[ October 10, 2007, 11:31 PM: Message edited by: KJ Duke ]
AROD team prediction???
Originally posted by KJ Duke:
quote:Originally posted by bjoak:
Mm, The Filding Bible had him at -12, but as you say that info is out of date. Other metrics show him to be consistantly bad every year including 2006, with a good 2007, probably an outlier rather than real improvement as he is starting to get up there in years. Last two seasons, team stats show Cubs had the least number of errors in the league at 3B. Second in fielding pct both years.
He came to the Cubs a bad 3b. He worked extensively with coaches to improve after that 1st season and has looked very good since. Doesn't have the range of some 3Bs, as he isn't exactly a skinny dude - but a strong consistent arm and makes the plays he should make. He's 29, btw. [/QUOTE]Errors are kind of besides the point and extra irrelevant in this instance since the only player I was talking about was Ramirez. When I said 'metrics' I didn't mean subjective stats developed in the 19th century. A guy strapped to a chair at third base might never make an error--that doesn't make him an effective fielder.
I'm aware that he's 29, which is a little old since baseball players tend to peak between 26 and 28.
quote:Originally posted by bjoak:
Mm, The Filding Bible had him at -12, but as you say that info is out of date. Other metrics show him to be consistantly bad every year including 2006, with a good 2007, probably an outlier rather than real improvement as he is starting to get up there in years. Last two seasons, team stats show Cubs had the least number of errors in the league at 3B. Second in fielding pct both years.
He came to the Cubs a bad 3b. He worked extensively with coaches to improve after that 1st season and has looked very good since. Doesn't have the range of some 3Bs, as he isn't exactly a skinny dude - but a strong consistent arm and makes the plays he should make. He's 29, btw. [/QUOTE]Errors are kind of besides the point and extra irrelevant in this instance since the only player I was talking about was Ramirez. When I said 'metrics' I didn't mean subjective stats developed in the 19th century. A guy strapped to a chair at third base might never make an error--that doesn't make him an effective fielder.
I'm aware that he's 29, which is a little old since baseball players tend to peak between 26 and 28.
Chance favors the prepared mind.
AROD team prediction???
Originally posted by bjoak:
quote:Originally posted by KJ Duke:
quote:Originally posted by bjoak:
Mm, The Filding Bible had him at -12, but as you say that info is out of date. Other metrics show him to be consistantly bad every year including 2006, with a good 2007, probably an outlier rather than real improvement as he is starting to get up there in years. Last two seasons, team stats show Cubs had the least number of errors in the league at 3B. Second in fielding pct both years.
He came to the Cubs a bad 3b. He worked extensively with coaches to improve after that 1st season and has looked very good since. Doesn't have the range of some 3Bs, as he isn't exactly a skinny dude - but a strong consistent arm and makes the plays he should make. He's 29, btw. [/QUOTE]Errors are kind of besides the point and extra irrelevant in this instance since the only player I was talking about was Ramirez. When I said 'metrics' I didn't mean subjective stats developed in the 19th century. A guy strapped to a chair at third base might never make an error--that doesn't make him an effective fielder.
I'm aware that he's 29, which is a little old since baseball players tend to peak between 26 and 28. [/QUOTE]have you ever played baseball bjoak?
quote:Originally posted by KJ Duke:
quote:Originally posted by bjoak:
Mm, The Filding Bible had him at -12, but as you say that info is out of date. Other metrics show him to be consistantly bad every year including 2006, with a good 2007, probably an outlier rather than real improvement as he is starting to get up there in years. Last two seasons, team stats show Cubs had the least number of errors in the league at 3B. Second in fielding pct both years.
He came to the Cubs a bad 3b. He worked extensively with coaches to improve after that 1st season and has looked very good since. Doesn't have the range of some 3Bs, as he isn't exactly a skinny dude - but a strong consistent arm and makes the plays he should make. He's 29, btw. [/QUOTE]Errors are kind of besides the point and extra irrelevant in this instance since the only player I was talking about was Ramirez. When I said 'metrics' I didn't mean subjective stats developed in the 19th century. A guy strapped to a chair at third base might never make an error--that doesn't make him an effective fielder.
I'm aware that he's 29, which is a little old since baseball players tend to peak between 26 and 28. [/QUOTE]have you ever played baseball bjoak?
AROD team prediction???
My line is: No, never have, but I do make it a lot more fun to watch, you see.
You can't always see or feel defense as much as you'd like to think so and when you can it can be verified objectively. Players like Ellis, Hudson, and Cameron don't look the best in our eyes and in computer analyses for no reason. Other players might not be embarrassing themselves with errors but that doesn't mean they're doing their teams any favors.
[ October 11, 2007, 01:11 AM: Message edited by: bjoak ]
You can't always see or feel defense as much as you'd like to think so and when you can it can be verified objectively. Players like Ellis, Hudson, and Cameron don't look the best in our eyes and in computer analyses for no reason. Other players might not be embarrassing themselves with errors but that doesn't mean they're doing their teams any favors.
[ October 11, 2007, 01:11 AM: Message edited by: bjoak ]
Chance favors the prepared mind.
AROD team prediction???
Originally posted by bjoak:
My line is: No, never have, but I do make it a lot more fun to watch, you see.
You can't always see or feel defense as much as you'd like to think so and when you can it can be verified objectively. Players like Ellis, Hudson, and Cameron don't look the best in our eyes and in computer analyses for no reason. Other players might not be embarrassing themselves with errors but that doesn't mean they're doing their teams any favors. bjoak, I've worked extensively with stats in my job and other things, as well as baseball. And IMO, stats can uncover things that are less than obvious to the eye, but also miss other things that are in fact obvious to the eye. Balance, and a theoretical framework that employs both elements, in my experience tends to lead to the best analysis.
My line is: No, never have, but I do make it a lot more fun to watch, you see.
You can't always see or feel defense as much as you'd like to think so and when you can it can be verified objectively. Players like Ellis, Hudson, and Cameron don't look the best in our eyes and in computer analyses for no reason. Other players might not be embarrassing themselves with errors but that doesn't mean they're doing their teams any favors. bjoak, I've worked extensively with stats in my job and other things, as well as baseball. And IMO, stats can uncover things that are less than obvious to the eye, but also miss other things that are in fact obvious to the eye. Balance, and a theoretical framework that employs both elements, in my experience tends to lead to the best analysis.