fantasyland I think not!

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Thu May 29, 2008 10:25 am

Wow, I go work on the football side for a few hours and all hell breaks out. Welcome aboard Ron. I haven't seen this side of you since John Hunt outbid you for Cal Ripken back in 1997 LABR!!

Ahhh, those were the days.

LABR and Tout Wars are promotional industry leagues that further the growth of what we're all doing here. To compare the participants is silly because the formats are different. Trading leagues vs. non trading leagues. Auction leagues vs. draft leagues. Ron and everyone in Tout Wars is worthy of being in that one and could beat anyone here on any given day, just like anyone here could beat anyone in LABR or Tout on any given day.

Heck, I'm in Ron's XFL Keeper League and SUCKING big-time. Every gamble back in November's draft blew up. Does that make me an idiot? Well, of course it does!!

UFS and I are 10th in LABR AL and 4th in LABR NL. ARe we half idiots? Of course again!!

Bottom line, we'd love to have any industry person competing in the NFBC. Ron has enough on his plate each spring flying from city to city for his First Pitch Forums to compete in the NFBC. Time-wise, it would be impossible for him. Could he compete with this group? ABSOLUTELY. But chiding him into our competition doesn't do anyone any good.

Last I looked, Walla Walla was winning the AL $1,300 Las Vegas Auction League. Stay focused there John as any league with Shawn and Eddie and the rest is where you should be focusing anyway.

Win that league first and then you can chide anyone to take you on in 2009!!

JohnZ · Post by **JohnZ** » Thu May 29, 2008 11:37 am

Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:

4th in LABR NL. A healthy Byrnes is all we need. Glad he went on the DL finally..

K.Wood, Cantu and C.Ross for $6

rkulaski · Post by **rkulaski** » Thu May 29, 2008 4:51 pm

Originally posted by Gordon Gekko:

quote:Originally posted by RON@HQ:

In other words, I think the best fantasy player in the country is probably someone who is unemployed (and thus cannot afford $1250) and has the time to follow baseball 24/7 and win every league he participates in. I know there has to be someone like that out there. And he probably could whip everyone in the NFBC *and* Tout Wars. Doubt it. Having free time does not equate to success by itself.

[/QUOTE]Totally agree with GG and actually I think sometimes having too much time to read and analyze all of the daily fantasy baseball content out there can sway you too far in a direction you normally wouldn't go. Even those who have the time to read these boards frequently - I wonder how many are swayed or change their opinions about certain players. At some point, whether you have 24 free hrs in the day or 2 hrs, it all comes down to deciding which information to follow and use to better your team.

sportsbettingman · Post by **sportsbettingman** » Thu May 29, 2008 5:05 pm

Believe me...there are hours upon hours where no game is being played, nor info being released in each day...the unemployed argument is overrated.

...not to mention this unemployed guy may not have the money for internet or DirecTV MLB superfan...and if this unemployed fantasy god had even the smallest brain...he'd be re-investing his winnings and upping his risk...eventually hitting the high stakes market.

...if not...he wasn't so good after all.

~Lance

[ May 29, 2008, 11:07 PM: Message edited by: sportsbettingman ]

sportsbettingman · Post by **sportsbettingman** » Thu May 29, 2008 5:10 pm

...and couldn't each and every argument you use to defend the Tout Wars Clan be used to defend each and every "Momma and Pappa" local exclusive league"???

Whose buzzed?

~Lance

Thunder · Post by **Thunder** » Thu May 29, 2008 5:37 pm

undoubtedly, the best thread of the year to date

CC's Desperados · Post by **CC's Desperados** » Fri May 30, 2008 1:06 am

Good morning Ron and Jeff....

I'm surprised to see both of you on these boards this early. Damn Jeff...it's ten minutes to 5 on the west coast.

Some of us play the high stakes game for the pay day...like the get out of jail fee card. And like you Ron, we all enjoy this game. With your recent sale, it's like you hit the home run. Maybe there were a few guys on base when you came to the plate. The NFBC is such a small market for pay sites that we shouldn't even matter.

With all the interest in fantasy sports these days, they might become a day when someone can't resist the opportunity for the big score. Writing about something you love is great, but winning the big prize is more exciting. This year football will have some unbelievable options. Hopefully baseball will follow.

Best of luck Ron.....and as I do think most aren't in Walla's camp about his views, I do think he can play in the high stakes game. If you ever get a chance to meet him, he is a good guy also. He just to likes ot stir up the pot once in awhile.

Walla ...good luck the rest of the way in the AL and I'm sorry if my team gets hot and catches you. But one thing you can't do is allow Gillis to three-peat.

[ May 30, 2008, 02:23 PM: Message edited by: CC's Desperados ]

Jeff Erickson · Post by **Jeff Erickson** » Fri May 30, 2008 10:59 am

Originally posted by CC's Desperados:

Good morning Ron and Jeff....

I'm surprised to see both of you on these boards this early. Damn Jeff...it's ten minutes to 5 on the west coast.

Yep, late night - I think I had signed off by the time you posted, but only by a little bit. I had to finish off an article last night and knew my online time today would be sparse. Clearly I found a way to procrastinate just a little longer.

Entertaining thread.

Schwartzstops · Post by **Schwartzstops** » Sun Jun 01, 2008 6:38 am

The question was never answered, so for the record, let me state that I won my NFBC main event league in 2006 (Chicago 3, IIRC) and finished 6th in the country. Last year I finished 3rd in my league (CHI4) and I'm in 3rd again this year in NY9, up to 59th in the country as of this morning. My best finish in four years of Tout Wars is 3rd place.

None of the above is to make any value judgments as to the superiority of one format or set of players over another. One is a 15-team mixed snake draft and the other is a 13-team NL-only auction, and I've faced good competition in both formats.

Just sayin'.

Thanks,

Cory Schwartz

MLB.com Fantasy 411

Wonder Boy · Post by **Wonder Boy** » Sun Jun 01, 2008 3:01 pm

Absolutely great stuff.

I've participated in the NFBC every year except the first one and played against the so-called best of the best in LABR (NL)---where I met Greg---it is just so hard to compare the two since they are both so different.

I must admit that after a bad NFBC season last year I started doubting my own knowledge of fantasy baseball and read Ron Shandler's bible from cover to cover. It has helped my re-think many different strategies and I am back to contender status in both the Main Event and in a NL $650 Auction League.

Ron is a God! I bow to you...

Steve Pletkin

Walla Walla · Post by **Walla Walla** » Sun Jun 01, 2008 3:39 pm

Well as Shawn pointed out I like to stir the pot from time to time. I figured with the football push starting up, the board here had gone dead. So why not make a crazy post to start some action.

I was fishing for guppies and the BIG WHALE popped

out with a reply. The man Ron. Hey I had to continue to play that one. Thats a rare siting seeing him here. Sorry Ron!

Your a good sport. Oh and no I'm still not bowing.

eddiejag · Post by **eddiejag** » Sun Jun 01, 2008 11:46 pm

It seem's like Walla doesnt get any respect as a fantasy player.And i heard RON'S smack talk about coming next year to kick his arse.But Walla is a better Fantasy player than most think or know.Walla won the 650 National Auction last year and currently way in first this year in the 1300 AL Auction.Some of the best players around in this league Van Hook,Zola,Childs,Herron, Morgan,Gillis ,and many more. Does Ron really want a piece of this,a Wolf in sheep's clothing.

Crazy Like a Fox · Post by **Crazy Like a Fox** » Sat Jun 07, 2008 8:42 pm

Originally posted by bjoak:

Straight from Shandler's mouth: Crazy Like a Fox is the best fantasy player in the country. LOL. Bjoak, what's so funny about your post is that as soon as I was done reading Shandler's post I was going to post that he was talking about me. Swear to god. And then I look down and see you posted it for me. Although I'm not unemployed, I thought some would get a kick out of it.

I do very much agree with Ron on this account, "A consistent NFBC winner is not only a good player, but also can afford to participate, which adds a huge caveat to assessing the best."

This is true. Yet, if he's avoiding the NFBC because he has "nothing to gain and everything to lose" then it probably contradicts why most people play fantasy baseball in the first place. We do it for the competition and the love of the game. And if you're passionate about baseball, love fantasy baseball, and are confident in your ability, then why not come to the NFBC and prove it, because clearly, there are many here who are skeptical. Prove us wrong!

Windy City Hustler · Post by **Windy City Hustler** » Sun Jun 08, 2008 6:14 am

Ron's job is to provide his readers with insight as soon as possible. He would need to refrain from working in order to fully maximize his advantage over other players.

Ron has parlayed his immense fantasy knowledge into an early retirement, while the rest of us toil to cover our expenses by winning whatever leagues we are in or cash in with a victory in the Main Event.

As you can see, the successful NFBC players are not on the boards talking about their sleepers or trends of players that they have on their radar.

Most of us would gladly give up the NFBC and high stakes fantasy for Ron's job and until the playing field is leveled, Ron's a wise man to ignore all requests to play in the NFBC.

Ron, you have nothing to prove, keep up the great work and congrats on your success.

GOD Loves You · Post by **GOD Loves You** » Sun Jun 08, 2008 7:48 am

Originally posted by Windy City Hustler:

Ron's job is to provide his readers with insight as soon as possible. He would need to refrain from working in order to fully maximize his advantage over other players.

Does he refrain from working to participate in his other leagues?

I don't think many doubt Ron's knowledge, but rather, the exclusion of the true experts in the so-called expert leagues.

Like I said before, there's at least one participant in Tout who has NEVER won a single league in his life. This person, as well as the CBS guys, leads me to believe that Tout isn't truly filled with experts.

Seriously, Ron, why not invite one of the NFBC guys who have proven their knowledge for a few years now??

JohnZ · Post by **JohnZ** » Sun Jun 08, 2008 7:54 am

Originally posted by GOD Loves You:

quote:Originally posted by Windy City Hustler:

Ron's job is to provide his readers with insight as soon as possible. He would need to refrain from working in order to fully maximize his advantage over other players.

Does he refrain from working to participate in his other leagues?

I don't think many doubt Ron's knowledge, but rather, the exclusion of the true experts in the so-called expert leagues.

Like I said before, there's at least one participant in Tout who has NEVER won a single league in his life. This person, as well as the CBS guys, leads me to believe that Tout isn't truly filled with experts.

Seriously, Ron, why not invite one of the NFBC guys who have proven their knowledge for a few years now?? [/QUOTE]The three-peat Mixed Champ is a NFBC player.

GOD Loves You · Post by **GOD Loves You** » Sun Jun 08, 2008 8:03 am

Outsider, John....not an industry expert.

Although, compared to most the other participants, I would consider Larry somewhat an outsider due to him not working for one of the "big boys". No offense Larry, just an opinion.

BTW, congrats on winning three years in a row, especially when you haven't participated that long!

JohnZ · Post by **JohnZ** » Sun Jun 08, 2008 8:16 am

Originally posted by GOD Loves You:

Although, compared to most the other participants, I would consider Larry somewhat an outsider due to him not working for one of the "big boys". When did you start playing fantasy baseball?

GOD Loves You · Post by **GOD Loves You** » Sun Jun 08, 2008 11:33 am

Originally posted by UFS:

quote:Originally posted by GOD Loves You:

Although, compared to most the other participants, I would consider Larry somewhat an outsider due to him not working for one of the "big boys". When did you start playing fantasy baseball? [/QUOTE]Loooooooooooong after you started.

John, ask the average fantasy player if they know about Larry/shrink compared to Yahoo, ESPN, CBS, MLB.com, Baseball Prospectus, etc. Heck, the average fantasy player thinks the TMR is truly talented, far from it IMO.

Hardcore players will know of Larry, average players will know the aforementioned "big boys".

JohnZ · Post by **JohnZ** » Sun Jun 08, 2008 12:55 pm

Originally posted by GOD Loves You:

quote:Originally posted by UFS:

quote:Originally posted by GOD Loves You:

Although, compared to most the other participants, I would consider Larry somewhat an outsider due to him not working for one of the "big boys". When did you start playing fantasy baseball? [/QUOTE]Loooooooooooong after you started.

John, ask the average fantasy player if they know about Larry/shrink compared to Yahoo, ESPN, CBS, MLB.com, Baseball Prospectus, etc. Heck, the average fantasy player thinks the TMR is truly talented, far from it IMO.

Hardcore players will know of Larry, average players will know the aforementioned "big boys". [/QUOTE]I concur 100% with all that you said..... The average guy is certainly someone that identifies with those things for sure....

That's the point I want to make though... The average guy is defining people they really don't know nearly as well as they think they do IMO.

Almost all the guys you listed are post internet. There's another decade plus of history many of you never acknowledge. To me, the "Shrink" is still one of the big guys!! They certainly were before the net and they still seem to be doing fine. I can easily see why any net only guys would think otherwise though.

Maybe Ron doesn't play because he's already proven himself "before" you even knew who he was. Do any of you guys ever consider that?

And if you've already proven yourself in your field of work, what would you do if you were asked to do it again? You'd laugh and mock for sure.

Let's say Shawn and GG don't win another league for five years. Do they have to prove themselves again? And poor Dan is having one of those years that happens every five years to anyone. Do they have to prove themselves again? I think not.

bjoak · Post by **bjoak** » Sun Jun 08, 2008 1:48 pm

Maybe Ron doesn't play because he's already proven himself "before" you even knew who he was. Do any of you guys ever consider that?

And if you've already proven yourself in your field of work, what would you do if you were asked to do it again? You'd laugh and mock for sure.

Let's say Shawn and GG don't win another league for five years. Do they have to prove themselves again? And poor Dan is having one of those years that happens every five years to anyone. Do they have to prove themselves again? I think not.Wow, totally disagree. If you don't do anything for five years, it means you were good once and are no longer, i.e. it also means you were once and are no longer an expert. Fantasy was a completely different game before the Internet, not so much because of the technical changes or even format changes but because the advancements in baseball analysis between 1992 and 2008 are akin to the advancements in medicine between 1890 and 1990. Anyone who is doing prep the same way he was 15 years ago is not doing well in a respectable competition 4 out of 5 times. You have to stay ahead of the curve.

sportsbettingman · Post by **sportsbettingman** » Sun Jun 08, 2008 2:00 pm

Many so-called experts are merely experts at marketing themselves as such.

~Lance

JohnZ · Post by **JohnZ** » Sun Jun 08, 2008 2:19 pm

Originally posted by bjoak:

quote:Maybe Ron doesn't play because he's already proven himself "before" you even knew who he was. Do any of you guys ever consider that?

And if you've already proven yourself in your field of work, what would you do if you were asked to do it again? You'd laugh and mock for sure.

Let's say Shawn and GG don't win another league for five years. Do they have to prove themselves again? And poor Dan is having one of those years that happens every five years to anyone. Do they have to prove themselves again? I think not.Wow, totally disagree. If you don't do anything for five years, it means you were good once and are no longer, i.e. it also means you were once and are no longer an expert. Fantasy was a completely different game before the Internet, not so much because of the technical changes or even format changes but because the advancements in baseball analysis between 1992 and 2008 are akin to the advancements in medicine between 1890 and 1990. Anyone who is doing prep the same way he was 15 years ago is not doing well in a respectable competition 4 out of 5 times. You have to stay ahead of the curve. [/QUOTE]I said if they don't win a league, not totally stink.

And no where did I say anyone was doing the same prep as 15 years ago, so why spin it into that? Is there anyone doing that at all?

Agree that you always have to stay ahead of the curve....

Windy City Hustler · Post by **Windy City Hustler** » Sun Jun 08, 2008 2:49 pm

Maybe the title 'Fantasyland' refers to Ron pulling down 7-figures for the sale of Baseball HQ? Beat him at that and I'd be impressed.

sportsbettingman · Post by **sportsbettingman** » Sun Jun 08, 2008 3:14 pm

Originally posted by Windy City Hustler:

Maybe the title 'Fantasyland' refers to Ron pulling down 7-figures for the sale of Baseball HQ? Beat him at that and I'd be impressed. Please wipe that brown stuff off your mouth.

~Lance