Main Event KDS Preferences

JohnZ · Post by **JohnZ** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 6:27 am

Originally posted by Gordon Gekko II:

quote:Originally posted by JohnZ:

And those that didn't would call and complain. Something Lance saw in his original post. The number of complaints would dwarf whatever Greg rec'd yesterday.

Changing to 15-1 makes zero sense from an operators POV. Just creates more work and hassle when it's least needed. nah. lazyitis is always a loser's bet.

maybe we shouldn't have a default KDS. if tom picks your name out of the hat and you have not set your KDS (meaning you don't care where you draft), then you don't get a draft slot until all the KDS people got theirs. my way is the best win/win out of the kds system. your way allows people who don't care where they draft to take preferred slots away from people who do care where they draft.

probably about 10% of owners don't give a rats-ass about where they draft or kds. [/QUOTE]Continued failure to see/recognize things from both sides of the fence and continuation of shoving agenda that gives you another perceived advantage that may or may not be there.

How do you know 10% don't care? Maybe 45 of the 58 wanted 1-15? Do we have to make a rules change because 13 owners forget and GG screams at the top of his lung about a problem that really doesn't exist? And why 15 to 1? Why not 8-15-1-7-14-2, etc??? What makes 15 to 1 the new default?

Are you saying Shawn Childs doesn't care? He left his at 1-15.

[ March 14, 2009, 12:32 PM: Message edited by: JohnZ ]

Asumijet · Post by **Asumijet** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 6:28 am

Originally posted by Timcards:

I cannot believe people would call and complain about their draft spot. I got the 15th pick, which sucked, but it never crossed my mind to phone or e-mail Greg to complain. You take the cards you're dealt and do the best you can.

If you're complaining about your spot before the draft even starts, you're already beat. Same here, 15th pick and 15th choice. So now, instead buying Greg a Corona when I see him on Thursday night, I wait an hour before I do so.

But I am curious what the data tells us about getting our preferences. It seems like last year, Greg mentioned that most got at least their 8th choice or better and that there was some data around that. This year, it seems like a lot of teams got there 13th, 14th and 15th choice. Compare the results to previous years and see if a 3RR might be in order or maybe even bid FAAB for the draft spots. That said, this is a heck af a lot better than random.

[ March 14, 2009, 12:36 PM: Message edited by: Asumijet ]

sportsbettingman · Post by **sportsbettingman** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 6:31 am

Shawn was in so many leagues in football, he forgot to set his lineup in WCOFF and lost his LCG. (He would have won $7,000)

Was he lazy...I doubt it. Oversight of being in as many as 20+ leagues for some of these die-hards. (See RT, Jules, KJ, Childs, etc who have been in crazy amounts of leagues this year or in past years.)

~Lance

[ March 14, 2009, 12:32 PM: Message edited by: sportsbettingman ]

Bobby J · Post by **Bobby J** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 6:52 am

Greg, are you able to post just one of 2 leagues entire KDS and see how many have 13,14,15 on the end. My guess would be most, and as you have said someone is going to be the 13th, 14th or 15th name drawn out of the hat. I may be wrong, have been before, but my guess is also that a higher percentage had the last 3 spots on their KDS as 13,14,15 than people had 1,2,3,4 at the front end

JohnZ · Post by **JohnZ** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 6:58 am

Originally posted by Asumijet:

[QUOTE] It seems like last year, Greg mentioned that most got at least their 8th choice or better and that there was some data around that. This year, it seems like a lot of teams got there 13th, 14th and 15th choice. Greg could provide better numbers, but the vast majority got 8th or better. I would be willing to wager at least 80%.

There are one, maybe two this year that got 13th or later in each league. But that is a yearly thing that changes.

I rec'd my 8th choice.

KDS is about giving owners a better chance at getting a pick they want over random distribution. It's not anything more than that.

Attie · Post by **Attie** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 6:59 am

I can't believe that a group of grown men, experts in their field, would complain about their draft slot. I got #4 pick, which was my third choice (2-1-4-3-7-6-5-8-9-10-11-12-13-14-15). That just allows me to start my plan. If I would have got pick #14, I would have planned accordingly. With 30 rounds, the draft slot is highly overrated in my opinion. The way I look at it, whoever gets last pick gets first pick in the second round, so what's the big deal? Greg and Tom are working like dogs for us, so let's get to work planning, and quit whining! I'm off to Vegas in 3 hours, maybe that's why I'm so mellow, but I say chill out.....

Gordon Gekko II · Post by **Gordon Gekko II** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 7:07 am

Originally posted by JohnZ:

Continued failure to see/recognize things from both sides of the fence and continuation of shoving agenda that gives you another perceived advantage that may or may not be there.

the failure would be on you john. i'm a player, not an operator. same goes for you. the best for PLAYERS is to have no default KDS or at least have it 15-1. as a PLAYER that is the BEST possible use of KDS. period.

Gordon Gekko II · Post by **Gordon Gekko II** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 7:15 am

Originally posted by sportsbettingman:

Shawn was in so many leagues in football, he forgot to set his lineup in WCOFF and lost his LCG. (He would have won $7,000)

i hope that's not true.

i limit the # of leagues i sign up for because there's not enough time in the day to effectively manage more than a handful.

HAUSBURGER · Post by **HAUSBURGER** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 7:21 am

Only in America can you hear about people putting up this kind of money to play a Fantasy Sports Game where they have a opportunity to put a draft preference of 1-15 in an such order they'd like and complain about it after the draft positions are announced. What is it, lack of preparation? Were you 13,14, 15 guys all taking it for granted you were going to get a top 7 pick? Just think you guys, you can now draft A-Fraud. If you were in the top 7, you wouldn't even think about it. It's right there for you now. Just because you aren't going to get your 1st round player doesn't mean you can't get the player you definitely want in the second.

As has been proven in the past, those who prepare the most, you will most likely see near the top of the leaderboard. Just go play the game. Have fun and enjoy the experience. I wish I could. Mark

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 7:22 am

Originally posted by Bobby J:

Greg, are you able to post just one of 2 leagues entire KDS and see how many have 13,14,15 on the end. My guess would be most, and as you have said someone is going to be the 13th, 14th or 15th name drawn out of the hat. I may be wrong, have been before, but my guess is also that a higher percentage had the last 3 spots on their KDS as 13,14,15 than people had 1,2,3,4 at the front end You folks know I love to analyze this stuff and I've posted KDS breakdowns throughout the satellite season with the average KDS being 4.8 or so for the most part. People seemed to have a little more variance in their KDS settings in the satellites. But yeah, if I have some time on Monday or Tuesday I'll gladly post some data by picking out a few leagues at random and going through the entire league. I trust that the average KDS preference will still be 5.8 or better, but there's no doubt that some folks in each league got their 12th, 13th or 14th picks, and even 15th.

Again, we are being as transparent as can be and providing all of the KDS preferences in this thread. You can see what most people were thinking and not as many wanted the back-end this year as in years past. I'll even analyze some of that data if I can find time this week before I split for Vegas.

JohnZ · Post by **JohnZ** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 7:35 am

Originally posted by Gordon Gekko II:

quote:Originally posted by JohnZ:

Continued failure to see/recognize things from both sides of the fence and continuation of shoving agenda that gives you another perceived advantage that may or may not be there.

the failure would be on you john. i'm a player, not an operator. same goes for you. the best for PLAYERS is to have no default KDS or at least have it 15-1. as a PLAYER that is the BEST possible use of KDS. period. [/QUOTE]Same does not go for me. I'm both. You're pretty naive to not think that both sides of the equation have to be weighed equally. Always has been no matter what you think is best for the PLAYER.

But I'll take off that operator hat and say I don't see how possibly pissing off 10% (as you state) is good for the PLAYERS at all for numerous reasons.

I want to see more PLAYERS in the event in the long run to raise the prizes than squeeze out the bottom of the tooth paste tube to get some perceived, minute advantage and not alienate anyone for any reason.

But that's just me. Just my opinion.

headhunters · Post by **headhunters** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 7:37 am

my 2 cents: last year and maybe in years past people actually were setting their kds wrong. as always greg heard about the problem- and fixed it . this year it is idiot proof. second- and i haven't checked- but i bet that in the 5 yeears of nfbc it has never happened that the 1st 4 picks ended the season as the top 4 producers. i would also bet that at least half the time the top player came outside of the top 4-5 drafted. could easily happen again. 3rd- i think this year more people kdsed the top than last and many people last year ( including me) kdsed the bottom 1st. with less people doing that it increases the chances of guys getting spots 13-15. the best poker players can play any hand. i am sure that will happen again. having said ALL of that- i see many good players picking 1st. more than i have ever seen. some of them will have hanly santana arod on their teams. if that happens - don't complain. everyone did not have a shot at hanly but everyone will have a shot at santana and arod.

Gordon Gekko II · Post by **Gordon Gekko II** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 7:42 am

Originally posted by JohnZ:

Same does not go for me. I'm both. you are not both in the nfbc. simple one there.

JohnZ · Post by **JohnZ** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 7:44 am

Originally posted by headhunters:

my 2 cents: last year and maybe in years past people actually were setting their kds wrong. as always greg heard about the problem- and fixed it . this year it is idiot proof. second- and i haven't checked- but i bet that in the 5 yeears of nfbc it has never happened that the 1st 4 picks ended the season as the top 4 producers. i would also bet that at least half the time the top player came outside of the top 4-5 drafted. could easily happen again. 3rd- i think this year more people kdsed the top than last and many people last year ( including me) kdsed the bottom 1st. with less people doing that it increases the chances of guys getting spots 13-15. the best poker players can play any hand. i am sure that will happen again. having said ALL of that- i see many good players picking 1st. more than i have ever seen. some of them will have hanly santana arod on their teams. if that happens - don't complain. everyone did not have a shot at hanly but everyone will have a shot at santana and arod. If A Rod is not out that long, anyone picking 5-8 should not let A Rod fall to a 1-4 pick.

See $100K winner from last year that got Pujols late 2nd rd.

Gordon Gekko II · Post by **Gordon Gekko II** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 7:44 am

Originally posted by headhunters:

the best poker players can play any hand. yes, because bluffing works in poker. bluffing doesn't work in fantasy baseball.

Gordon Gekko II · Post by **Gordon Gekko II** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 7:47 am

let me wrap my interest in this thread up...

1) as usual, Greg/Tom have done a great job here

2) MOST owners got a more preferred draft slot than random

3) a SMALL % of owners had to take one for the team and get a backend pick. i just wish it woulda been the owners who don't care where they draft (ie don't set kds).

back to prep. later all.

sportsbettingman · Post by **sportsbettingman** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 7:58 am

Don't let Peyton get back to the LT owners!!!

JohnZ · Post by **JohnZ** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 8:02 am

Originally posted by sportsbettingman:

Don't let Peyton get back to the LT owners!!! Don't let Lance get A Rod at #3!!

CC's Desperados · Post by **CC's Desperados** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 8:21 am

Originally posted by sportsbettingman:

Shawn was in so many leagues in football, he forgot to set his lineup in WCOFF and lost his LCG. (He would have won $7,000)

Was he lazy...I doubt it. Oversight of being in as many as 20+ leagues for some of these die-hards. (See RT, Jules, KJ, Childs, etc who have been in crazy amounts of leagues this year or in past years.)

~Lance Lance-

I didn't forget to set my lineup. I was home all day. I changed it when I saw the news about Chad Johnson. As I was doing it, I received a phone call which I was discusssing Chad Johnson. I summitt my lineup, but I must have done something wrong because it didn't go through. I look at while talking and though it was right, but I must have check Johnson again. He was the highest receiver. I ment to click the bootom running back.

Either way....I should have doubler checked it as some point in the day. There was at least seven hours between the news and game time.

It was never a result of having too many leagues. It was me making a mistake and being distarcted while setting my lineup and me not taking the time to check to make sure it was right. I had Johnson on two teams and it was right in the other league.

sportsbettingman · Post by **sportsbettingman** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 8:27 am

Originally posted by CC's Desperados:

quote:Originally posted by sportsbettingman:

Shawn was in so many leagues in football, he forgot to set his lineup in WCOFF and lost his LCG. (He would have won $7,000)

Was he lazy...I doubt it. Oversight of being in as many as 20+ leagues for some of these die-hards. (See RT, Jules, KJ, Childs, etc who have been in crazy amounts of leagues this year or in past years.)

~Lance Lance-

I didn't forget to set my lineup. I was home all day. I changed it when I saw the news about Chad Johnson. As I was doing it, I received a phone call which I was discusssing Chad Johnson. I summitt my lineup, but I must have done something wrong because it didn't go through. I look at while talking and though it was right, but I must have check Johnson again. He was the highest receiver. I ment to click the bootom running back.

Either way....I should have doubler checked it as some point in the day. There was at least seven hours between the news and game time.

It was never a result of having too many leagues. It was me making a mistake and being distarcted while setting my lineup and me not taking the time to check to make sure it was right. I had Johnson on two teams and it was right in the other league. [/QUOTE]My mistake, Shawn...I forgot you mentioned that.

Either way, it runs in line with my point that adding more silly stuff like screwing with the default of a KDS preference is adding to the chances of an oversight and is not needed.

~Lance

CC's Desperados · Post by **CC's Desperados** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 8:27 am

Originally posted by Gordon Gekko II:

let me wrap my interest in this thread up...

3) a SMALL % of owners had to take one for the team and get a backend pick. i just wish it woulda been the owners who don't care where they draft (ie don't set kds).

How does don't care come from not setting your KDS?

We start with our number one KDS preference and somehow you take it as we could give two shits where we draft.

There was one team with 15-1 out of 390.

If you give people enough rope, they will hang themselves.

P.S....tell Cindy I said "hi"

sportsbettingman · Post by **sportsbettingman** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 8:30 am

Originally posted by JohnZ:

quote:Originally posted by sportsbettingman:

Don't let Peyton get back to the LT owners!!! Don't let Lance get A Rod at #3!!

[/QUOTE]Go ahead and grab A-fraud...Give me Timmy L in the 2nd!

Gordon Gekko II · Post by **Gordon Gekko II** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 8:34 am

Originally posted by CC's Desperados:

P.S....tell Cindy I said "hi" you are probably cindy!

billywaz · Post by **billywaz** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 8:38 am

I think the issues with all the discussion on this thread are two fold....

1) Greg is correct that I am sure out of the 58 (I believe that is correct), that a bunch DID in fact want 1-15 as their KDS. I know it was a consideration for me about a month ago.

2) Setting the KDS at 15-1 THIS year is a PERCEPTION of what everyone wants. Next year, maybe there are two guys going on the turn that everyone wants.

Unless there is a way to check if someone did in fact change their preferences (have a box that they check to say they like their KDS "as is"), just leave it like it is, and go from there.

That all being said, I wouldn't have any problem with the "slackers" (for lack of a better word) getting the "leftovers" either.

I just don't agree with changing it from 15-1.

[ March 14, 2009, 02:40 PM: Message edited by: billywaz ]

CC's Desperados · Post by **CC's Desperados** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 8:42 am

Originally posted by eddiejag:

Here's what i did. 3 4 2 5 6 7 1 10 9 8 11 12 13 14 15.Every year is different last year i wanted 11 or 12. This year i felt their was a top 7 Rameriz,Puljols,Reyes,and Wright followed by Sizemore,Cabrera,and Braun.After these 7 you could go 10 different way's so picking 8 threw 15 can look so different in draft's. Just look at this guys KDS-

How do you know that the player you would except at 3 or 4 doesn't slid to 5 or a player who is exceptable at 5, 6, or 7 doesn't slide to 8. By moving from 1 to 10, he gives up a chance on possibibly getting player in his first 6 choices if somehow that player slide a spot or two.

This year not many people were willing to move to draft slots 14 and 15.