WCOFB Baseball

DOUGHBOYS · Post by **DOUGHBOYS** » Wed Oct 12, 2011 7:16 am

When I think of Shawn Childs I think of a nice man who knows his baseball. Nothing more nothing less.

John, while your right hand was typing, your left hand was passing judgment.

Shawn was hired by Dustin to do a job. Big deal. Shawn's called me a few times, he never once insinuated that I should try the 'other contest'.

He wasn't selling the other contest.

I forget who started the shill business. But, it is an undeserved tag.

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Wed Oct 12, 2011 7:34 am

Originally posted by Walla Walla:

WCOFB spoke persons Shawn Childs and Eddie Gillis

were once the darlings of the NFBC. Than they got drawn to the WCOFB. Offers of being writers for a Web Site free rooms extra. It didn't pan out. But the thing that made me wonder about all this was Greg inviting Shawn to do the LABR leagues. Granted Shawn was a HOF for the NFBC. But by that time he was a Shill for the WCOFB. Not passing judgement. Just wondering about the behind the scene moves here. What does Shawn working with Dustin and Jesse to grow their games have anything to do with my friendship with Shawn? He continued to play in the NFBC and NFFC and he continued to be my friend. My goodness, this space has had 2-3 competitors and everyone expects them to hate each other. Why? Every business has competitors and usually a lot more than we have here, but you don't have to wish bad on them to succeed. I wish WCOFF had continued to succeed and paid their winners. We'd all be better off if they had done that.

What a poor post John, and you've had many. In fact, while looking through past posts for the draft spots of league champions, yours continued to stand out. Do you know how many threads you've started about quitting the NFBC or leaving the NFBC or advising others to leave? Believe it or not, your very first one was in 2004 called "I Won't Be Back."

http://nfbcboards.stats.com/cgi-bin/ult ... 1;t=000404

Again, Shawn and I were friends and continue to be friends. And we finished 2nd in LABR AL and 3rd in LABR NL this year, quite an accomplishment. Everyone in LABR now knows and respects Shawn and they know he is the brains of this team. When we win both LABR League titles next year, all of those sites will want to hire Shawn -- not me -- to write for them and I'll be proud of that. In fact, I will be Shawn's shill if you don't mind.

[ October 12, 2011, 02:47 PM: Message edited by: Greg Ambrosius ]

NorCalAtlFan · Post by **NorCalAtlFan** » Wed Oct 12, 2011 8:19 am

that was priceless Greg.

going in the way back machine was brilliant

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Wed Oct 12, 2011 8:49 am

Originally posted by NorCalAtlFan:

that was priceless Greg.

going in the way back machine was brilliant How ironic that the only person who responded to John's "I Won't Be Back" thread from 2004 was Kevin Deckel, Shawn's partner that year. Kevin left the NFBC after 2007, so John outlasted him!! Quite an accomplishment.

Baseball Furies · Post by **Baseball Furies** » Wed Oct 12, 2011 5:39 pm

I echo Max's sentiment here. I'm sure glad that I did not get pulled in the WCOFB scam. When I first read about it, it did sound a little too good to be true. The first person I called about it was our good pal, Steve Jupinka, and asked his honest opinion about coming on board with the WCOFB, and thanks to him, I dodged a bullet by not enrolling in this crap. And as far as this Dustin guy "getting sick", it has been my experience that the evil within people does have a tendency to eat them up and make their life their suffering kind of like the cancer of dishonesty and lack of integrity has inflicted in this instance...Ask him if it was worth all of his and his associates ill-gotten gains now .

Less than Dave · Post by **Less than Dave** » Thu Oct 13, 2011 5:19 am

Devastating. I never had a clue until I called their office after the season ended to ask how to collect my winnings and they didn't answer... then I saw that the message board had been shut down and I feared the worst. I "only" won $6,000, but I was heavily depending on that money as I lost my job after injuring myself in April and now cant afford to live in my apartment anymore as a result... that $6k would have given me another year to figure things out... and now I don't even know if I'll be able to play NFBC next year for the first time since I started when I was 23... WCOFB was one of the biggest regrets of my life. Lesson learned - once I can afford it again, only playing NFBC from here on out. If I can't afford to join you all next season, it's been a pleasure... and I fully intend to return when I am able to.

Chest Rockwell · Post by **Chest Rockwell** » Thu Oct 13, 2011 6:36 am

Originally posted by Less than Dave:

Devastating. I never had a clue until I called their office after the season ended to ask how to collect my winnings and they didn't answer... then I saw that the message board had been shut down and I feared the worst. I "only" won $6,000, but I was heavily depending on that money as I lost my job after injuring myself in April and now cant afford to live in my apartment anymore as a result... that $6k would have given me another year to figure things out... and now I don't even know if I'll be able to play NFBC next year for the first time since I started when I was 23... WCOFB was one of the biggest regrets of my life. Lesson learned - once I can afford it again, only playing NFBC from here on out. If I can't afford to join you all next season, it's been a pleasure... and I fully intend to return when I am able to. Dave,

A couple of things.

1) sorry about your job and your injury.

2) If you are willing to move somewhere else get your resume to your nfbc brothers.

3) Let's stay in contact. I really enjoy drafting and the month of April. The job just starts killing me in May-Sept. Maybe we can do a partnership in some higher dollar leagues that makes sense for you to run some teams during the grind and we do a share of some sort on profits.

I honestly hate to hear this happening to you. You are a bright young guy with a great future.

Layin'theSmackDown · Post by **Layin'theSmackDown** » Fri Oct 14, 2011 7:57 am

I wasn't aware that a managing partner could just step down and walk away from debts. Of course I'm not a lawyer so who knows

If there's a group forming out there I'd like to join up..if only to get some kind of response. I don't like the idea of just letting it pass.

Originally posted by Glenneration X:

Dustin called me back shortly after I made my previous post. I do appreciate him getting back to me. We spoke for about a little over a half an hour.

He explained that he's still very ill and had to step down as managing partner of Gridiron and the WCOFF. As far as the future of the WCOFF and payments to those owed, he couldn't really offer any new information. How that all plays out has yet to be determined.

I'm sorry I couldn't provide more or better updates. Good luck to all those owed, I hope we all get what's due us.

[ October 14, 2011, 02:02 PM: Message edited by: Layin'theSmackDown ]

southpaw23 · Post by **southpaw23** » Sun Oct 16, 2011 10:24 am

I've gone back and disputed the original charges that they put on my credit card. I submitted an explanation along with printouts of final standings and emails to the company that went unanswered.

Let you know how it turns out.

Less than Dave · Post by **Less than Dave** » Fri Oct 21, 2011 8:17 am

Originally posted by Chest Rockwell:

quote:Originally posted by Less than Dave:

Devastating. I never had a clue until I called their office after the season ended to ask how to collect my winnings and they didn't answer... then I saw that the message board had been shut down and I feared the worst. I "only" won $6,000, but I was heavily depending on that money as I lost my job after injuring myself in April and now cant afford to live in my apartment anymore as a result... that $6k would have given me another year to figure things out... and now I don't even know if I'll be able to play NFBC next year for the first time since I started when I was 23... WCOFB was one of the biggest regrets of my life. Lesson learned - once I can afford it again, only playing NFBC from here on out. If I can't afford to join you all next season, it's been a pleasure... and I fully intend to return when I am able to. Dave,

A couple of things.

1) sorry about your job and your injury.

2) If you are willing to move somewhere else get your resume to your nfbc brothers.

3) Let's stay in contact. I really enjoy drafting and the month of April. The job just starts killing me in May-Sept. Maybe we can do a partnership in some higher dollar leagues that makes sense for you to run some teams during the grind and we do a share of some sort on profits.

I honestly hate to hear this happening to you. You are a bright young guy with a great future. [/QUOTE]Kent, thanks so much, I really appreciate your concern... you're a really good guy. I'd definitely be interested in exploring some options with you if we could make it work... and yeah, I'd be willing to move somewhere else for a job if it was the right job/situation.. I'm also looking into some things here as well... I'll PM you and we can talk further

Less than Dave · Post by **Less than Dave** » Fri Oct 21, 2011 8:20 am

This isn't my area of expertise, but since I'm pretty certain what WCOFB did was illegal, taking our money without due compensation, is there any thoughts to a class action lawsuit against them? Led by one lawyer who can cover all of us to reduce court costs? I just feel like we have to do SOMETHING.

Raskol · Post by **Raskol** » Fri Oct 21, 2011 8:23 am

Originally posted by Less than Dave:

This isn't my area of expertise, but since I'm pretty certain what WCOFB did was illegal, taking our money without due compensation, is there any thoughts to a class action lawsuit against them? Led by one lawyer who can cover all of us to reduce court costs? I just feel like we have to do SOMETHING. They sure seem to be slipping off into the distance. None of their websites are running now--front end, back end, nada.

Road trip to St. Louis? Catch a WS game, knock on Dustin's door, etc.?

Less than Dave · Post by **Less than Dave** » Fri Oct 21, 2011 8:38 am

yeah, if I had the 6 grand they owe me I'd actually be able to afford that... instead I have to move out of my apartment and beg for food lol

DOUGHBOYS · Post by **DOUGHBOYS** » Fri Oct 21, 2011 10:04 am

Originally posted by Less than Dave:

This isn't my area of expertise, but since I'm pretty certain what WCOFB did was illegal, taking our money without due compensation, is there any thoughts to a class action lawsuit against them? Led by one lawyer who can cover all of us to reduce court costs? I just feel like we have to do SOMETHING. A scam took place in our town. A financier promising too good to be true interest rates.

Most of the money was already either hid well or spent. The folks here got 15cents back on the dollar.

However, the financier was arrested, found guilty in court and sentenced to eight years in prison.

This should be the next step for Dustin.

Has anybody contacted law enforcement about this?

DOUGHBOYS · Post by **DOUGHBOYS** » Fri Oct 21, 2011 10:08 am

By the way, those folks did not get that 15 cents on the dollar back till it was located by law enforcement.

It seems to be the only way you'll see the money that WCOFB absconded with.

[ October 21, 2011, 04:13 PM: Message edited by: DOUGHBOYS ]

bustouts · Post by **bustouts** » Sat Oct 22, 2011 2:26 am

I dont care itf I get 10 cents back, i'd rather see them all in jail!!!

damien p · Post by **damien p** » Sat Oct 22, 2011 4:06 pm

The FPA is asking people to report money owed from wcofs

Less than Dave · Post by **Less than Dave** » Sun Oct 23, 2011 9:13 pm

Originally posted by damien p:

The FPA is asking people to report money owed from wcofs what is that and how do we do this?

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Mon Oct 24, 2011 2:22 am

Originally posted by Less than Dave:

quote:Originally posted by damien p:

The FPA is asking people to report money owed from wcofs what is that and how do we do this? [/QUOTE]Guys, at this point there's nothing the Fantasy Sports Trade Association or the Fantasy Players Association can do for you unless they decide to hire a lawyer themselves and fight for your winnings, which doesn't look like it's happening. The FPA was looking for a total of money owed to players and I can do that right now if they want it. I know what it is and it's SICKENING.

The bottom line is that 2010 WCOFF players and 2011 WCOFB players were not paid in full and in many cases were not even notified that they wouldn't be paid. The WCOFB season just disappeared without Dustin or anyone else explaining what happened. They haven't even filed bankruptcy, which was the expected next move. They have just left their financial commitments behind and moved on with their lives, leaving a big black eye for the industry. Poof, they've been absolved.

If Chad or Kevin or anyone else is spearheading a legal action, they should post here and let others join the civil dispute. I had heard that some owners who were owed $100,000+ were going to do that. If they have, please update owners on the proceedings. We'll help spread the word. That is your best chance of seeking retribution, not reporting how much you are owed to the FPA.

southpaw23 · Post by **southpaw23** » Mon Oct 24, 2011 2:34 am

Email: [email protected]

with all the info on your wcofs non-payment.

League, dates, name, address, amount owed, all that good stuff

southpaw23 · Post by **southpaw23** » Mon Oct 24, 2011 6:23 am

Originally posted by southpaw23:

I've gone back and disputed the original charges that they put on my credit card. I submitted an explanation along with printouts of final standings and emails to the company that went unanswered.

Let you know how it turns out. So some good news on a personal level. My credit card bank (in this case Chase) has issued a chargeback to WCOFS's bank for my entry fees. I wrote out a lengthy description of what happened and my main dispute reason was fraudulent intent. The merchant held a contest which they had no intention of paying out. (which is arguable because of football payments)

I guess we'll see how WCOFS's bank likes their actions, especially if there are others.

No idea if the chargeback will stick. If the money isn't there, I'm not sure if my temporary credit will hold. But at least I've tried.

Chest Rockwell · Post by **Chest Rockwell** » Mon Oct 24, 2011 6:55 am

Originally posted by southpaw23:

quote:Originally posted by southpaw23:

I've gone back and disputed the original charges that they put on my credit card. I submitted an explanation along with printouts of final standings and emails to the company that went unanswered.

Let you know how it turns out. So some good news on a personal level. My credit card bank (in this case Chase) has issued a chargeback to WCOFS's bank for my entry fees. I wrote out a lengthy description of what happened and my main dispute reason was fraudulent intent. The merchant held a contest which they had no intention of paying out. (which is arguable because of football payments)

I guess we'll see how WCOFS's bank likes their actions, especially if there are others.

No idea if the chargeback will stick. If the money isn't there, I'm not sure if my temporary credit will hold. But at least I've tried. [/QUOTE]My 2nd job out of school was working for a large credit card processing company. You got the hard part accomplished (the issuing bank on your credit card). I would be shocked if it does not stick in your favor. Now Dustin's issuing bank will hit back the company he chose to process through. The larger the company the better as your amount would not have even been reviewed in my old world. I have no idea how it works if you paid by Amex/discover though as they are set up differently

Less than Dave · Post by **Less than Dave** » Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:02 am

Originally posted by southpaw23:

quote:Originally posted by southpaw23:

I've gone back and disputed the original charges that they put on my credit card. I submitted an explanation along with printouts of final standings and emails to the company that went unanswered.

Let you know how it turns out. So some good news on a personal level. My credit card bank (in this case Chase) has issued a chargeback to WCOFS's bank for my entry fees. I wrote out a lengthy description of what happened and my main dispute reason was fraudulent intent. The merchant held a contest which they had no intention of paying out. (which is arguable because of football payments)

I guess we'll see how WCOFS's bank likes their actions, especially if there are others.

No idea if the chargeback will stick. If the money isn't there, I'm not sure if my temporary credit will hold. But at least I've tried. [/QUOTE]Could I possibly get a copy of the email you wrote them so I could use your wording and just change the individual details for my own situation (my email is [email protected])? I was considering doing something like this but didn't really know how to go about it... also, I don't remember my league information if I need that... I just know I finished 1st in my league and I know I had Shawn Childs, Ryan Houston, and others in it... maybe one of them knows that info. Sadly, getting my $2k back would be a win at this point...

southpaw23 · Post by **southpaw23** » Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:31 am

Originally posted by Less than Dave:

quote:Originally posted by southpaw23:

quote:Originally posted by southpaw23:

I've gone back and disputed the original charges that they put on my credit card. I submitted an explanation along with printouts of final standings and emails to the company that went unanswered.

Let you know how it turns out. So some good news on a personal level. My credit card bank (in this case Chase) has issued a chargeback to WCOFS's bank for my entry fees. I wrote out a lengthy description of what happened and my main dispute reason was fraudulent intent. The merchant held a contest which they had no intention of paying out. (which is arguable because of football payments)

I guess we'll see how WCOFS's bank likes their actions, especially if there are others.

No idea if the chargeback will stick. If the money isn't there, I'm not sure if my temporary credit will hold. But at least I've tried. [/QUOTE]Could I possibly get a copy of the email you wrote them so I could use your wording and just change the individual details for my own situation (my email is [email protected])? I was considering doing something like this but didn't really know how to go about it... also, I don't remember my league information if I need that... I just know I finished 1st in my league and I know I had Shawn Childs, Ryan Houston, and others in it... maybe one of them knows that info. Sadly, getting my $2k back would be a win at this point... [/QUOTE]I can email you the document I faxed the disputes dept. but I also had screenshots of all the final standings, league standings, payout schedule, etc. I grabbed them right at the end of the season before the website went down.

According to the Chase representative, those screenshots were essential to them moving forward with it, along with my detailed account.

The only thing they questioned or wondered was where in the rules it stipulated how long they had to payout the winners.

FFBL23 · Post by **FFBL23** » Mon Oct 24, 2011 6:35 pm

Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:

quote:Originally posted by Less than Dave:

quote:Originally posted by damien p:

The FPA is asking people to report money owed from wcofs what is that and how do we do this? [/QUOTE]Guys, at this point there's nothing the Fantasy Sports Trade Association or the Fantasy Players Association can do for you unless they decide to hire a lawyer themselves and fight for your winnings, which doesn't look like it's happening. The FPA was looking for a total of money owed to players and I can do that right now if they want it. I know what it is and it's SICKENING.

The bottom line is that 2010 WCOFF players and 2011 WCOFB players were not paid in full and in many cases were not even notified that they wouldn't be paid. The WCOFB season just disappeared without Dustin or anyone else explaining what happened. They haven't even filed bankruptcy, which was the expected next move. They have just left their financial commitments behind and moved on with their lives, leaving a big black eye for the industry. Poof, they've been absolved.

If Chad or Kevin or anyone else is spearheading a legal action, they should post here and let others join the civil dispute. I had heard that some owners who were owed $100,000+ were going to do that. If they have, please update owners on the proceedings. We'll help spread the word. That is your best chance of seeking retribution, not reporting how much you are owed to the FPA. [/QUOTE]I am not spearheading any type of legal action at this point. I have had multiple people contact me about going after these crooks. At this time I am evaluating all my options and I will make a decision very soon. My advice to anyone who isn't owed a large sum of money, is to say the hell with it and move on. After legal fees, etc. it isn't even worth it and lawyers won't waste their time with you. Sorry.

This whole thing is just sick.

Kevin